[schrocat]

Too busy running for President.
He's gotta keep his eye on the ball...har dee har har.

[Ninong]

Originally Posted by schrocat

Too busy running for President.
He's gotta keep his eye on the ball...har dee har har.

He did respond!

He flat out lied to Matt Lauer:

Majority Leader Bill Frist this morning on the Today Show:

LAUER: But when you stood on the floor and you said, She does respond, are you at all worried that you led some senators…


FRIST: I never said, She responded. I said I reviewed the court videotapes – the same ones the other doctors reviewed – and I questioned, Is her diagnosis correct?

Frist on Senate Floor, 3/17/05:

I have looked at the video footage. Based on the footage provided to me, which was part of the facts of the case, she does respond.

More from Frist, 3/17/05:

She certainly seems to respond to visual stimuli…

[Ninong]

Dr. Frist, in two separate speeches on the Senate floor within a 12-hour period, challenged the diagnosis of Florida doctors who had actually examined Terri Schiavo. Relying solely on family videotapes, he argued that Florida doctors had erred in saying that Terri Schiavo was in a persistent vegetative state.

Doesn't the moron realize that it's all on C-Span? Does he think he's back home in Tennessee where he can change his comments to suit each audience?

Maybe his new shoes are too tight?

[schrocat]

Originally Posted by Ninong

He did respond!

He flat out lied to Matt Lauer:
Majority Leader Bill Frist this morning on the Today Show:

LAUER: But when you stood on the floor and you said, She does respond, are you at all worried that you led some senators…


FRIST: I never said, She responded. I said I reviewed the court videotapes – the same ones the other doctors reviewed – and I questioned, Is her diagnosis correct?

Frist on Senate Floor, 3/17/05:

I have looked at the video footage. Based on the footage provided to me, which was part of the facts of the case, she does respond.

More from Frist, 3/17/05:

She certainly seems to respond to visual stimuli…

I read that on the TP site.
...my favorite comment so far:

You liberals make me want to puke! Dr. Frist says “I never said ‘She responded’” and he didn’t! He CLEARLY says: “…she does respond.”

Two words vs. three!


Advantage: wingnuts!!!

[Ninong]

Maybe lying is a new family value? I mean if Bill Bennett can lie about the millions he lost gambling, why can't Dr. Frist lie about what he said three months ago on the floor of the Unites States Senate?

If George Bush can lie to the American people about the "evidence" we have that Saddam is attempting to buy yellow cake uranium in Niger, why can't Dr. Frist tell a few now and then? (The evidence I am referring to is a letter signed by the foreign minister dated in 2000, only the name of the foreign minister was one who was out of office since 1989. That and the fact that it was on the wrong letterhead and contained numerous misspellings should have been a tipoff that it was a forgery, which it was. This and other forged documents that we "relied on" to build our WMD case against Saddam were published in an Italian newspaper in March 2003.) That's certainly not in the same league with lying about your extramarital affairs, which is an impeachable offense.

At least Dick Cheney doesn't lie about what he says on the floor of the Senate. If you don't like it, he says you can go... (This is a family board. I can't repeat what the Vice-President of the United States, on the floor of the Senate, told a United States Senator he should go do.)

[almostdiva]

I think it's pretty amusing that he and Hilary are now collaborating on a bill about health care. BOTH of them trying to appear less partisan and hard-core.

Does he not GET that what he says is on the public record and can come back to haunt him?? Evidently NOT!

[Ninong]

Originally Posted by almostdiva

Does he not GET that what he says is on the public record and can come back to haunt him??

My first take on Sen. Frist is that he is inept and not charismatic enough to make it to the White House. For better or worse, we have to accept the obvious fact that running for national office is very much a popularity contest. That's not all of it but it's a significant enough part that people like Al Gore or John Kerry were fighting an uphill battle. Both of them could have used a charisma implant. The harder they tried, the more painfully obvious it became that they were working at being likeable.

Anyone who is stupid enough to park his gigantic, gas-guzzling black SUV in a no-parking zone while he runs into a shoe store to blow $530 on a couple pair of shoes is not the sort of person we should trust to make critical decisions for our country. No normal person running for national office would do something so politically incorrect if they had half a brain to begin with. Talk about a sound bite! He makes the nightly news accepting a parking ticket from the meter maid while a group of jeering protesters provides a suitable chorus for the background.

Let's see how many things were wrong with that picture if you're trying to portray yourself as just a regular guy who wants to become president:

• Don't display your arrogance and above-the-law attitude by parking in a moving traffic lane. Everyone who has ever gotten a parking ticket will applaud when they see you getting one, too! It's like seeing someone practically run you off the road to pass you at 20 mph above the speed limit and then seeing them pulled over five minutes later by a traffic cop. I don't know about you, but I laugh every time.

• If you're going to spend $285 a pair for shoes, don't let the figures get out. Most of the voters spend less than that on a pair of shoes. People will start calling you Emelda.

• If you're going to drive a full-sized, gas-guzzling SUV, try not to get your picture taken with it unless, like Ah-nult, you have gigantic ego to go with it. As a Republican, you already have the gigantic SUV owners vote locked up so you need to worry about capturing some of the non-SUV owners.

• When caught in an embarrassing situation by a TV news crew, don't look so serious. Laugh it off and get the hell out of there. Never enter into a political discussion with sidewalk protesters while the TV cameras are rolling and your SUV is being ticketed in the background.

[schrocat]

Jeb officially drops all Presidential ambitions.

Please leave my state, you obviously can't leave it like you found it...so just leave.
Take your greedy wife who makes Hillary look like a saint, your crackhead daughter...and go.

[Ninong]

"I think it's sad and disgusting given the governor's continuing unwarranted meddling in this case," Felos said. "The extent to which he will prostitute himself to right-wing constituents for his future political gain I think is just pitiful."

The autopsy results also drew a response from Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist, who said Thursday he doesn't regret using his standing as a doctor to question Terri Schiavo's diagnosis from afar during the intense national debate over whether to remove her feeding tube.

Frist, a heart surgeon, said he accepted the results of Schiavo's autopsy but stood by his statements on the Senate floor last March, when he argued that on videotape Schiavo appeared to respond to her family. "Would I do it over again? Yes, I would do it over again," he said.

Frist and other Republicans pushed through unprecedented emergency legislation, signed by President Bush, aimed at prolonging Schiavo's life by allowing the case to be reviewed by federal courts. But federal courts rejected the parents' request to have her feeding tube reinserted.

Let me see if I understand the new compassionate conservative view of conservatism. If you disagree with a decision of state courts, then it's the duty of the federal government to try to get federal courts to overturn the decision of the state courts in a matter of state jurisdiction if it involves a right-to-life issue that is important to your theocon base. On the other hand, it would not be appropriate to get the federal courts involved in any state death penalty cases because that's strictly an issue of state jurisdiction and not a true right-to-life issue.

OK, got it now! If you don't like the state courts' decisions, you interfene federally but if you like their decisions, you leave things alone.

Wow! This new conservatism is really confusing until you get the hang of it. First they tell you Washington is the problem and then they tell you Washington should overturn your own state's courts if those courts render a decision that is not agreeable to them.

The autopsy results did little to change the opinions of Florida legislators who supported Gov. Bush's efforts to require the court to reinsert Schiavo's feeding tube.

Sen. Daniel Webster, R-Winter Garden, and Rep. Dennis Baxley, R-Ocala, who had joined Bush in pushing for legislative intervention in March, were unmoved by the autopsy findings.

The autopsy "affirmed the fact that she died because of an order of the state," Webster said. "For us to do that, we should have known positively what her will was. We didn't."

Nor was there any change on the other side, particularly among the nine Republicans who blocked the March legislation.

"That the brain was half the size, that she couldn't have been fed, that she was blind ... really said that we played politics with this issue and shame on us," said Sen. Nancy Argenziano, R-Crystal River, one of the nine Republican senators.

Were it not for those nine conservative Republicans who stood up against the Governor of Florida in his attempt to pass a second ad hoc law in this case, we would still be waiting for the Florida Supreme Court to throw out another unconstitutional law motivated by reckless political opportunism on the part of the wingnuts in control of the Republican Party.

The Pinellas-Pasco Medical Examiner's Office, which received at least 500 e-mails in the days surrounding Schiavo's death, received more than 20 more the day after the autopsy was released.

"I would just like to tell you folks that I was one of those doubting Thomas's. I thought Terri could have been helped," Gladys Furber wrote. "I believe your findings. Sometimes we don't want to see things, and we don't want to believe these things. I believe it's called denial."

At least one person who thought that Terri Schiavo could be helped now admits that it was hopeless. But she's obviously not a Republican politician running for national office.

Jeff Donius of Frankfort, Ill., wrote: "You guys have no credibility whatsoever ... it's all a bunch of propaganda and manipulated data aimed at confirming the lies of Michael Schiavo."

Wingnuttery in all its glory. Maybe this guy should move from Frankfort, Illinois to Topeka, Kansas. He could run for the school board or join that Baptist Church run by that Phelps crackpot.

In addition, former Lee County Sheriff John J. McDougall received six months' probation, a $600 fine and community service after he was convicted in a Largo courtroom Wednesday of trying to enter Terri Schiavo's hospice to give her water. McDougall, a Catholic who has been outspoken on right-to-life issues, was arrested March 19 outside Hospice House Woodside in Pinellas Park, where he was trying to take water to Schiavo.

McDougall, 62, could have avoided court by paying a $250 fine. He demanded a trial and was convicted Wednesday of trespassing.

He did the right thing and the court did the right thing. If you believe that strongly in something, even if everyone else knows you're wrong, you should act on your beliefs within reasonable guidelines of civil disobedience but then you should be willing to accept the consequences and the court should enforce those consequences.

Too bad the Republicans wouldn't allow that amendment to the recent federal bankruptcy bill that would have prohibited people from including court-ordered fines and restitution resulting from illegal activities blocking women's health clinics. That would have prevented people like the Schindlers' official spokesperson, Randall Terry, from filing bankruptcy to avoid all the court-ordered restitution payments resulting from his criminal acts. And it would have left him with less money to contribute to Eric Rudolph's defense fund.

[Ninong]

Speaking of neocon Republicans, if any of you guys are reading this thread, you might want to visit this MSNBC live poll and vote in it because at the moment it looks like your guy is getting clobbered: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8248969/

Do you believe President Bush misled the nation in order to go to war with Iraq? * 25922 responses

Yes
93%

No
7%




P.S. -- I just rechecked that MSNBC live poll and things aren't getting any better for fearless leader:

Do you believe President Bush misled the nation in order to go to war with Iraq? * 45582 responses

Yes
94%

No
6%


P.P.S. -- It's getting worse! Dear Leader is not going to like this:

Do you believe President Bush misled the nation in order to go to war with Iraq? * 57914 responses

Yes
95%

No
5%

[Ninong]

Check this out: http://slate.msn.com/id/2121020/

It explains how the family tried to con everyone into thinking Terri was responding to commands when they knew all along she was not responding. It explains how they selected certain frames from hours and hours of tape and how the frames were edited.

Anyone who views the entire tapes, like the judge did, can plainly see that she is not responding and that her parents were well aware of this fact all along.

Her parents were as blind as she was.

[schrocat]

When I was a kid, I visited retirement homes and hospices through our Presbyterian youth group.
It was depressing, but I can't imagine the anguish that would have been heaped on with the religious right and Hannity foaming and shrieking and calling people murderers in the parking lot.

Life and Death go on...

[Ninong]

What's up with Jeb Bush continuing to beat the Terri Schiavo drum? Does he really think that her husband, who spent years doing everything in his power to revive her, could possibly have had a role in her collapse?

What bugs me most about these self-righteous Republican politicians is their holier than thou attitude. Bush doesn't care about Terri Schiavo nearly as much as he cares about his own political future. It's ironic that he and his famous brother have had their share of problems with their daughters. When Dubya was governor of Texas he signed legislation that was supposed to guarantee time in jail for a third alcohol related offense for anyone under the age of 21 but somehow or other his own daughters never saw the inside of a cell even though one was involved in alcohol related offenses three times and the other one either once or twice, I lost track.

And it really galls me that people like Jeb Bush and Bill Frist should make a big deal about the fact that Michael Schiavo, years after his wife's collapse, should take up with another woman and start a new life. Bill Frist is such a good example himself. And I'm not talking about the fact that he "adopted" stray cats from the local animal shelter to practice on (under anesthesia) while in medical school, but the fact that he slept around on his fiance just days before their wedding and then lied about it when he flew home to Nashville to cancel their wedding TWO DAYS before it was to take place! It seems he had met another woman (his present wife) while interning in Boston and had dinner and an overnight stay with her. It was love at first sight and he needed to cancel his wedding plans fast. He has admitted that he made up stories that were not true when he flew home to call off the wedding just two days before it was supposed to take place.

So how does a guy like Bill Frist expect to get that past the religious wingnuts in 2008? By showing up at all their hate fests and promising to do their bidding. Speaking of showing up, here's a guy who admits he hardly ever voted before he decided to run for the Senate.

[Ninong]

On the same topic, the Louisiana Senate yesterday voted 37-0 for a bill that would remove authority for life-sustaining decisions from a spouse if that spouse was co-habitating in a marriage-like arrangement with another person. I heard that on the radio, so I'm not sure of the full details such as who the decision-making authority passes to in such cases but I assume it might be the parents or the adult children.

So if you don't want your in-laws making such decisions, you had better stay celibate forever if your spouse becomes incapacitated.

P.S. -- We pass a lot of goofy laws in Louisiana. We're trying to keep up with Alabama. We tried to mandate the teaching of creation science in public schools but the U.S. Supreme Court threw that one out. We can't be bothered with passing a state law banning cockfighting because, as everyone knows, a rooster is a "fowl" and not subject to animal cruelty laws. I kid you not.

[almostdiva]

Ninong,

Isn't Louisiana one of like 2 states where cockfighting is still legal???

Some guy did an article in either Smithsonian or Nat'l Geographic a few years ago where he went to all these cockfights -- lots of pictures (not really expose style, but more pictoral essay -- this is the cockfighting world type shots). It was pretty interesting/amazing. I was surprised that anything like that happened in the 21st century.

Rebecca

[Ninong]

Originally Posted by almostdiva

Ninong,

Isn't Louisiana one of like 2 states where cock fighting is still legal???

Some guy did an article in either Smithsonian or Nat'l Geographic a few years ago where he went to all these cock fights -- lots of pictures (not really expose style, but more pictoral essay -- this is the cock fighting world type shots). It was pretty interesting/amazing. I was surprised that anything like that happened in the 21st century.

Rebecca

Rebecca,

I'm not sure exactly how many states it is still legal in. The last time I checked, which was probably two or three years ago, it was legal in parts of Louisiana, New Mexico and Oklahoma. There are efforts in all three states to have it banned. In Louisiana, there are local ordinances against it but no state-wide law banning it because the real rednecks, those in the northern part of the state, won't go for it. There are rednecks all over this state but some are redder than others.

During the 1940's, the neighbor to the rear of my grandmother's house, bred roosters for fighting. My brother and I and our cousins were all little kids then. That was during the war years. We were all in first, second and third grades in school. I remember one day when we saw him in his backyard and we climbed to the top of the fence to ask about all his "chickens." That's when we found out that the roosters were being bred for fighting. He explained it all to us. He showed us his best birds and he petted them just like they were puppies. I thought it strange that he would want to hurt his "pets." On a later visit, I remember looking through a knothole in the fence to see him wringing the necks of a few birds that were in bad shape. He just picked up the rooster by the head and swung it around violently to snap its spine. He told us those were "winners" who had been messed up too bad to keep.

I just did an online search and came up with the following but I don't know how up-to-date it is:

COCKFIGHTING: A blood sport for roosters

Although it is illegal in 48 states, cockfighting is a tradition that dates back several centuries and spans several cultures. Thus it is difficult to stamp out. Like other illegal animal fights, cockfights take place surreptitiously.

During cockfights, two roosters are placed into a ring to fight to the death. Roosters are born with natural spurs, which are removed and replaced with razor sharp blades called gaffs. These gaffs can measure up to three inches in length.

The fighting roosters are dosed with various legal and illegal drugs such as strychnine, caffeine, and amphetamines. These drugs force the roosters to become more aggressive and increase their endurance. According to the Oklahoma Coalition Against Cockfighting, “strychnine is one of the most popular stimulants. It and other drugs give birds a "boost" despite multiple puncture wounds or knife wounds.” Although they have been bred to fight, the animals often become tired and weak and suffer severe injuries as a result.

Although birds in a flock often fight to establish a pecking order, these battles rarely result in injury. Only birds that have been bred and provoked to fight will inflict the serious injuries seen in cockfighting. The cockfighting pit allows roosters no opportunity to escape and thus most cockfights result in the death of one or both of the birds.

Children often witness this cruel spectacle. Because adults bring children to fights as a form of cultural initiation, kids may come away from fights with insensitivity to violence against animals. Studies have shown that violence against animals is a precursor to violence against humans.

Cockfights are usually conducted in an arena in front of spectators who gamble on the event. Spectators viewing the fights bet large sums of money. The handler of a winning rooster often wins a big profit.

While the United States has a long tradition of cock fighting, as do several Asian cultures, we now recognize that it is unacceptable to continue such archaic forms of entertainment. You can help by writing to the governors of Louisiana and New Mexico to ask that they curb this cruel practice for good.

Office of the Governor
P.O. Box 94004
Baton Rouge, LA 70804-9004
Fax: 225-342-7099

Office of the Governor
State Capitol, Room 400
Santa Fe, NM 87501




Dog Fighting

All 50 states and the District of Columbia have banned dog fighting and it is a felony offense in 47.(7) Illegal dog fighting, however, remains a pervasive if hidden practice in many cities. Trainers prepare a dog to fight by imposing a cruel regimen on the dog from the beginning of his life. Dog fighters starve the animals in order to make them mean, beat them to make them tough, place heavy chains around their necks to increase muscle mass, and force them to run on treadmills or to endure other exhausting exercise for long periods of time.(8)

In order to foster the viciousness of dogs, trainers bait them with puppies, cats, and other small animals. "Bait dogs include small Labrador retrievers, German shepherds or mixed breeds and are often cut or stabbed and tossed in with the larger fighting dogs."(8) These dogs, having been beaten and deprived, maul the small animals to death.

In dogfights themselves, dogs are forced to fight with severe injuries, often until one or more dogs are dead. Spectators force dogs to continue fighting by prodding and hitting them with sharp objects.

Trainers favor pit bulls over other dogs because pit bulls have strong jaws. Well-treated and humanely raised pit bulls are affectionate and loyal dogs. To the surprise of many people, they are also good with children. Only pit bulls bred and trained to fight become violent and dangerous animals.

Those in the profession of dog fighting over-breed pit bulls, contributing to the large number of animals languishing in shelters throughout the country. Shelters euthanize many of these dogs because homes cannot be found for them.

Cruelty to animals is a precursor to violence against humans. Please report any knowledge of dog fighting or other animal fighting to authorities.


P.S. -- According to that website, it looks like it's just Louisiana and New Mexico where cockfighting is still legal. http://www.idausa.org/campaigns/spor...kfighting.html

P.P.S. -- In Louisiana, one of the representatives from New Orleans brings up a bill every year to get cockfighting banned statewide but it never gets out of the agricultural committee. You can guess which types of lawmakers sit on the agricultural committee.

[Ninong]

Rebecca,

This report appears to be very up-to-date. It seems that Oklahoma outlawed cockfighting in 2002, so it's just parts of Louisiana and New Mexico where it is still legal.

It's not surprising that the Committee on Agriculture in the Louisiana house voted 9-5 to reject a ban on cockfighting in spite of the fact that 82% of the people in Louisiana favor such a ban. You would have to have been born and raised here to understand politics in this state. The rooster was the symbol of the Louisiana Democratic Party during the days of Huey Long and his brother Earl. They didn't use the donkey like the rest of the country's Democrats. Republicans were a non-factor in those days. When you went into the polling booth, you were expected to pull the big lever at the top under the rooster. That automatically voted the entire state Democratic ticket. I remember going with my dad in the 1940's.

All of those good ole boys are now Republicans. Some of them, like Billy Tauzin, started out as Democrats and later switched registration to Republican. Others, like Trent Lott in neighboring Mississippi, ran as Republicans from the get-go. Trent worked for a Democratic Congressman but when it was time to run for office, he put his finger to the wind and decided the tide was shifting to Republicans. His pals at the White Citizens Council told him that would be the best way to go. (P.S. -- Trent got his early "leadership" training the same way Dubya did, he was a cheerleader for the boys' football team. Dubya was a cheerleader at Andover, Trent was a cheerleader at Ole Miss.)

[schrocat]

yet again.


This is going to be hilarious.

Wasn't somebody talking about a Republican majority for life around here someplace? lol

Hard to do with a split party...

[almostdiva]

Originally Posted by schrocat

yet again.


This is going to be hilarious.

Wasn't somebody talking about a Republican majority for life around here someplace? lol

Hard to do with a split party...

Schroat --

What kind of republican is this guy King? Is he a moderate, like Olympia Snow and Arlen Specter (and a very few others), or is he more like Randall Terry??? What do people in Fl. think of Terry in the post-Schiavo era? We in the cynical Northeast urban areas think he's a quack, but I realize not every one shares my opinion.

Rebecca

[Ninong]

Is Randall Terry now claiming residence in St. Augustine? How long do you have to live in a district before you can run for office? Will he be running as a Republican? Do you guys have open primaries like we have in Louisiana?

I wonder if he'll ask Ricky Santorum to help him out since he helped Ricky scoop up some of that Terri Schiavo cash when Ricky was down there consoling the family -- on the Wall-Mart private jet. The Wall-Mart private jet that flew him down there and then flew him around the state to all of those fundraisers. While he was down there consoling the family, he figured he may as well hit up all those nice right-to-life folks since they were all bunched up like that and "excited."

I can't imagine Randall Terry carrying any district for anything, even dogcatcher. But then I didn't expect David Duke to carry my local parish when he ran for Louisiana's First Congressional seat that was vacated by the disgraced Speaker-elect Bob Livingston. That seat went to David Vitter and he has already parlayed it into a seat in the U.S. Senate.

It's crazy down here in Louisiana. Everybody runs in the same primary. You might have half a dozen Republicans and two or three Democrats all running for the same office. Then, if no candidate gets a majority of the votes, they have a runoff between the top two vote getters. The top two could be from different political parties or they could be from the same party.

What happened when they ran against Mary Landrieu in her re-election race for the U.S. Senate was that so many Republican male candidates entered the race that they split the Republican vote along gender lines and a female Republican candidate ended up in second place. She was more than 20 points behind Landrieu in the primary but that didn't mean anything because almost all of the Republican voters would vote for her in the runoff. If Landrieu had gotten a majority in the primary, there wouldn't have been a runoff but she didn't. Landrieu did win the runoff but it was fairly close. In that race you had two women, both Catholics, both from the New Orleans area running against each other. So the Republican candidate decided to make religion an issue, believe it or not. She wondered why the Archbishop of New Orleans was allowing Mary Landrieu to receive communion since she obviously "wasn't a good Catholic" because of her support for early term abortions.

I just googled Randall Terry and was surprised to see how many different hate groups he is the president of. Maybe he just wants to do like David Duke -- run for political office so that he can skim the campaign contributions for his personal use. That's how they finally nailed David Duke. The IRS got him for failure to report all the money he stole ("converted to personal use").

P.S. -- David Duke, if you will remember, was the Republican Party candidate for governor against Edwin Edwards. Duke ended up in the runoff against Edwards because he came in second in the primary. That was several years ago. Campaign posters at the time said "Vote for the Crook, it's Important!" That's a reference to Edwards, who had been indicted so many times by the feds and gotten off each time that he felt he was immune to prosecution. They finally nailed him a few years ago and he's in a federal prison now. Our three-term former governor (who was a U.S. Congressman before he became governor) is doing time for extorting $400,000 out of Eddie DeBartolo. Eddie paid a $1 million fine and lost his beloved SF 49ers.

So right now we have Duke and Edwards both doing federal time. We can also claim FIVE INSURANCE COMMISSIONERS convicted of felonies. Let's see any other state top that!