[Ninong]

Here we go again! A new $27 million Creation Museum is set to open in Petersburg, KY this coming Monday.

Remember our thread on Dr. Dino? He's still blogging from prison. They moved him from the county jail to a federal facility in Marianna, Florida and then just this past week they shipped him to some place in South Carolina. His Dinasaur Adventure Land seems to be still up and running according to their website.

Well now the folks in northern Kentucky won't have to drive all the way to Florida to get their fill of biblical science. Ken Ham's new "creation-science" museum features human children playing with dinosaurs in Eden. This is based on his Dinosaurs of Eden "science" text book that can be yours for only $13.99. (Only $10.74 at Wal-Mart.) If that's still too much money, try his What Happened to the Dinosaurs for only 50 cents.

What's that? You're afraid to let your children go on the Ark ride with Noah and T. rex because you're afraid T. rex might eat your kids? Not to worry, according to Ken Ham, it's a scientific fact that T. rex was a strict vegetarian. T. rex and all the other dinosaurs got along just fine on the Ark. In fact, the dinosaurs only disappeared from Earth a few hundred years ago. That's another scientific fact you will learn at the new creation-science museum when it opens Monday.

The new creation-science museum has a faith-based planetarium where they will explain that the light from the stars did not take millions/billions of years to get here. That's one of those filthy reality-based science myths.

There will be an exhibit that explains that a belief in Evolution is the cause of most of society's problems. It shows models of children leaving an Evolution class. Soon the girl is on the phone to Planned Parenthood and the boy cruises the Internet for porn sites and it was all caused by the teaching of Evolution.

Ken Ham's very profitable non-profit organization hopes that you and your family will enjoy your visit to their new $27 million creation-science museum where you can learn all about geography, history and science from the Bible. Ham is a true believer in the inerrancy of the Bible. Like Jerry Falwell, they want everyone to believe "the Bible is the inerrant...word of the living God. It is absolutely infallible, without error in all matters [including] geography, science, history."

Admission is only $19.95 for adults and $9.95 for children. The faith-based planetarium is $5.00 extra.

While you're there, be sure to visit the Dragon Hall bookstore to pick up a copy of their new faith-based Aquarium Guide for only $19.99. "With aquariums around the world using God’s amazing creatures to teach evolution, Christians need information that gives them biblical truth." This new book counters all that filthy fact-based evolution crap that many public aquariums are pushing on our innocent children these days.

P.S. -- Speaking of Jerry Falwell, his "gravely unresponsive" carcass was finally buried this past Tuesday. Hallelujah!

[zhenya]

Yep, got to put this in my 1000 places in America to see book...
On the other hand I rather be dooing this all day...

[Ninong]

Look what I found on YouTube. It's Ken Ham telling the little children all about the evils of evolution and how God created the dinosaurs on the sixth day.

Near the end of the clip, a couple of high school kids are asked what they want to be when they grow up and one dude says he's going to be a biochemist and "win a Nobel prize in creationism." He intends to study biochemistry at the Creation Science Institute. That sounds worse than studying law at Regent University.

[Ninong]

Originally Posted by Ninong

Look what I found on YouTube. It's Ken Ham telling the little children all about the evils of evolution and how God created the dinosaurs on the sixth day.

NEW YORK About one-third of the American adult population believes the Bible is the actual word of God and is to be taken literally word for word, a new Gallop poll reveals. This percentage is only slightly lower than several decades ago.

Gallup reports that the majority of those "who don't believe that the Bible is literally true believe that it is the inspired word of God but that not everything in it should be taken literally." Finally, about one in five Americans believe the Bible is merely an ancient book of "fables, legends, history, and moral precepts recorded by man."

There is also a strong relationship between education and belief in a literal Bible, Gallup explains, with such belief becoming much less prevalent as schooling continues.

Those who believe in the literal Bible amount to 31% of adult Americans. This is a decline of about 7% compared with Gallup polls taken in the 1970s and 1980s. It is strongest in the South.

Belief in the literal word of the Bible is strongest among those whose schooling stopped with high school and declines steadily with educational level, with only 20% of college graduates holding that view and 11% of those with an advanced degree.

[Qcks]

mmm...

I might be missing your point, but it's really not surprising that those who don't value education are ignorant in regards to religion.

The ignorant are ignorant. (I use ignorant in the traditional meaning, not the western colloquialism meaning stupid and rude.)

More important then the fact that they are ignorant, is to find the reason why they are ignorant. Poverty, class discrepancies, and overall negative learning experiences are all things that would influence ignorance more directly then religion. Religion is a common element because it allows a certain degree of comfort in being ignorant, but, on it's own, i do not think it directly contributes to the problem.

One problem religion does create is fanaticism, which is a subject in-it-of-it's-self.

[Ninong]

Originally Posted by Qcks

I might be missing your point, but it's really not surprising that those who don't value education are ignorant in regards to religion.

Sorry for the confusion but the only point of that post was to show that there is potentially a large market for Ken Ham's new $27 million Creation Museum.

[Ninong]

Pat Robertson's CBN website has a very favorable article on Ken Ham's new Creation Museum, including a video interview with Ham. It's in their "Science" section.

The Creation Museum's goal is nothing less than proving that everything the Bible says about creation, the flood and the universe is literally true.

The $27 million museum plans to put you into Noah's Flood. Zip you all around the universe. Get you just inches away from roaring dinosaurs.

All to prove that the Bible's scientific claims are 100-percent true.

"They are not being given scientific evidence to actually support the Bible's account of history, so that's why we built the Creation Museum."

Ham says the museum is going to be a rallying point for Christians to say "you see, the Bible is true and we can show the world it is."

P.S. -- I forgot to mention that their "state-of-the-art" planetarium is designed to prove that the Earth is at the center of the universe and that the light from the stars doesn't take millions or billions of years to reach us. How could it take millions of years when the entire universe is only 6,000 years old? No, I didn't make that up. That's one of their "scientific" claims: the entire universe is geocentric! They do, however, concede that the Earth is round and that it orbits the Sun.

This is a "creation science" museum. They start out with the assumption that everything in the Bible is literally true (biblical inerrancy). If everything in the Bible is literally true, then all natural observations must confirm the origin of life as set forth in the Book of Genesis. Ken Ham and his Answers in Genesis crackpots are attempting to prove that real science confirms the account in Genesis. To say that they have their work cut out for them is the understatement of the century.

[Ninong]

Originally Posted by Qcks

More important then the fact that they are ignorant, is to find the reason why they are ignorant. Poverty, class discrepancies, and overall negative learning experiences are all things that would influence ignorance more directly then religion. Religion is a common element because it allows a certain degree of comfort in being ignorant, but, on it's own, i do not think it directly contributes to the problem.

This new $27 million Creation Museum is a perfect example of how religion directly contributes to ignorance. Innocent children whose parents abuse them by exposing them to this crap will require remedial instruction in the areas of science misrepresented by Ken Ham and his Answers in Genesis cult, assuming they wish to attend a real university and not Regent or Liberty.

Pity the poor child who has dreams of becoming a medical doctor or an astronomer or a biologist or a geologist or a paleontologist and who enters college believing the nonsense propagated by the Answers in Genesis whackos. They will have to be deprogrammed first before they will be able to understand any of the natural sciences. Evolution is the unifying foundation of virtually all the sciences.

[Qcks]

Which brings this discussion to the effect and causation of human ignorance and the role played by religion. Quite a messy subject but, i'll indulge:

Before i get into this though, it's possible that ignorant isn't the correct term, since ignorance implies a conscious rejection of knowledge. Certain individuals, whether through cultural conditioning or individual inadequacy fundamentally lack the ability to understand certain scientific concepts.

I disagree with the idea that religion directly contributes to ignorance. Religion might act as a coping mechanism for ignorance, which might be where the confusion lies. Coping mechanism's don't cause the initial problem, they mask it.

The 27 million Christian Learning museum doesn't make the individual ignorant. It lets the person be ignorant and keep piece of mind while donating $20.00 to the opportunistic entrepenuer.

i have more but... i'll stop there for now.

[Ninong]

Originally Posted by Qcks

Before i get into this though, it's possible that ignorant isn't the correct term, since ignorance implies a conscious rejection of knowledge.

I always thought ignorance meant simply a lack of knowledge.

Certain individuals, whether through cultural conditioning or individual inadequacy fundamentally lack the ability to understand certain scientific concepts.

Which is a reflection of intelligence, not ignorance.

I disagree with the idea that religion directly contributes to ignorance.

In this instance, religion is directly contributing to a lack of knowledge by substituting misinformation and passing it off as scientific knowledge. It is a deliberate campaign to mislead people into believing something that is absurd. The Answers in Genesis whackos are attempting to prove that the universe is only 6,000 years old. They have set up a planetarium to prove this, which is hilarious. The Milky Way galaxy itself is 100,000 light years across, so even if there was nothing else in the universe, that would give us a minimum age of 100,000 years, but these crackpots are trying to prove that the universe is only 6,000 years old.

Religion might act as a coping mechanism for ignorance, which might be where the confusion lies. Coping mechanism's don't cause the initial problem, they mask it.

Of course religion is a coping mechanism for ignorance. That's the very foundation of all religions. Religions were invented to explain the unknown. Religions thrive on fear and guilt and ignorance.

The 27 million Christian Learning museum doesn't make the individual ignorant. It lets the person be ignorant and keep piece of mind while donating $20.00 to the opportunistic entrepenuer.

It misinforms them. It pretends to be a scientific museum and claims that everything they read in the Bible is literal truth that can be verified in science. This is nonsense. One person's opportunistic entrepreneur is another person's scam artist. These people are con artists.

[Qcks]

Originally Posted by Ninong

I always thought ignorance meant simply a lack of knowledge.

Nope. That would be uninformed or unaware. The word ignorance is largely misused within the context of modern society; it's a shame since it's a necessary distinction within a language, at least in my opinion.

Ignore and Ignorance both come from the same root word (ignarus). The western colloquialism is based of the characteristics of a truly ignorant person; that is to say both stupid and rude.

To be ignorant requires a conscious disregard of truths and facts.

In this instance, religion is directly contributing to a lack of knowledge by substituting misinformation and passing it off as scientific knowledge.

no. A scam artist is passing it off as scientific knowledge while clothing said scam in the cloth of religious enlightenment. It's a little different, and should be much more insulting then a cult spending 27 million to build a giant idol, which is the only real equivalent in my opinion.

Of course religion is a coping mechanism for ignorance. That's the very foundation of all religions. Religions were invented to explain the unknown. Religions thrive on fear and guilt and ignorance.

Not true. Superstitions were invented to explain the unknown. Religions, though each individual religions does share common superstitions among it's members, were invented to reinforce a certain lifestyle.

[Ninong]

Originally Posted by Qcks

Nope. That would be uninformed or unaware.

Actually every English dictionary that I have checked gives my definition as the primary definition: Ignorance means a "lack of knowledge." Encarta definition, Merriam-Webster definition. To be ignorant does not require a conscious disregard of truth and facts, it merely requires a lack of knowledge.

The word ignorance is largely misused within the context of modern society; it's a shame since it's a necessary distinction within a language, at least in my opinion.

That's my opinion, too, which is why I never misuse it. Ignorance is often used as a synonym of stupidity but not by me.

Ignore and Ignorance both come from the same root word (ignarus).

Ignarus means quite literally not knowing. It's a combination of gnarus (knowing) with in- (not) -- the "n" is dropped. The classical Latin root is ignoro, ignorare (to be ignorant of), which gives us ignorantia (ignorance). That word itself is derived from the negative prefix in- (not) and gnoscere (to know). As you can see, there is nothing in the origin of this word that implies a conscious disregard of truth and facts, merely a lack of knowledge.

The western colloquialism is based of the characteristics of a truly ignorant person; that is to say both stupid and rude.

Yes, but using ignorance in this way displays ignorance, doesn't it? Why would anyone do that deliberately unless they were uninformed?

To be ignorant requires a conscious disregard of truths and facts.

Not true! You're now talking about willful ignorance which is not the same thing as ignorance.

Not true. Superstitions were invented to explain the unknown. Religions, though each individual religions does share common superstitions among it's members, were invented to reinforce a certain lifestyle.

Early religions were founded on superstitions which gave rise to myths. All of the major contemporary religions share many aspects in common with early creation myths.

[Qcks]

I concede that i may be attaching more meaning to the word then is strictly proper. This may be due to the fact that I live in the West; that seems to be the usage i encounter. It's nice to hash out some of the terminology though, since i just got a much clearer view of what you meant in the original post.

Yes, but using ignorance in this way displays ignorance, doesn't it? Why would anyone do that deliberately unless they were uninformed?

Contextually, it depends.

People resist change; even if that change is for the better. It's why people don't do things, despite volumes of scientific research that say they should do it.

Early religions were founded on superstitutions which gave rise to myths. All of the major contemporary religions share many aspects in common with early creation myths.

The thing is though, that doesn't change the fact that religions are social institutions with political asperations, monetary resources, and social networks.
In the context of the modern age, fundamentalist religions are natural focal points for people who are incapable of comprehending or accepting scientific facts. It's not that the religion necessarily institutionalizes this ignorance, rather, it provides a way for them to network with others who hold similar beliefs and values.

[Ninong]

Originally Posted by Qcks

The thing is though, that doesn't change the fact that religions are social institutions with political asperations, monetary resources, and social networks.

Modern (post circa 325 CE) religions certainly are. Political aspirations and monetary resources were the raison d'etre of the Christian church from the fourth century. They also became the primary source of what could be considered entertainment. Long before Shakespeare, there were gothic cathedrals where the people could gather to be entertained.

In the context of the modern age, fundamentalist religions are natural focal points for people who are incapable of comprehending or accepting scientific facts.

I thought that was the purpose of the Republican Party?

It's not that the religion necessarily institutionalizes this ignorance, rather, it provides a way for them to network with others who hold similar beliefs and values.

Let me give you one specific example of how the wing-nut wing of fundamentalist Christianity institutionalizes ignorance. There was a big stink online a few months back when it was discovered that a young paleontolgist (Ph. D. in paleontology) who had just received his Ph.D. from a prestigious university (not Liberty or Regent) had chosen to join the faculty at Regent (it was either Liberty or Regent, but I believe it was Regent) where he declared his personal belief in young Earth creationism.

There were even demands from some of his former colleagues that his doctorate be annulled or something. This guy (who was about 29 at the time) was regarded by his professors as a brilliant paleontologist. His doctoral thesis on mosasaurs was considered well researched and brilliantly presented. He carefully dated all of his finds over the correct era, meaning more than 65 million years ago. There was nothing in any of his writings to suggest he had any doubts whatsoever about the age of the Earth.

When asked how he could now take the position that the Earth was only 6,000 years old, he simply replied that that is what he believes based on faith and that it has nothing to do with what he knows based on what he learned in college. That is the most contradictory statement I have ever heard. Now Regent Liberty has a paleontologist with a Ph.D. from a prestigious university who teaches his students that the Earth is only 6,000 years old, in spite of the fact that his doctoral thesis states just the opposite.

[Qcks]

Now Regent has a paleontologist with a Ph.D. from a prestigious university who teaches his students that the Earth is only 6,000 years old, in spite of the fact that his doctoral thesis states just the opposite.

It's amazing what people do for money.
Palentologists aren't known to be the richest people in the world, but i'll refrain from conjecture.

Any sane US citizen should recognize the dangers of fundamentalst christianity, being that it's the original terrorist religion in the US. The key isn't that it's a religion, it that it's a fundamental religion. Fundamentalism clearly demonstrates a disconnect from reality. Thing can't go back to the way they were, and it's craziness to think otherwise.

[Ninong]

Originally Posted by Ninong

Let me give you one specific example of how the wing-nut wing of fundamentalist Christianity institutionalizes ignorance. There was a big stink online a few months back when it was discovered that a young paleontolgist (Ph. D. in paleontology) who had just received his Ph.D. from a prestigious university (not Liberty or Regent) had chosen to join the faculty at Regent (it was either Liberty or Regent, but I believe it was Regent) where he declared his personal belief in young Earth creationism.

Dept. of Corrections: It was Liberty University and his name is Dr. Marcus Ross, Assistant Professor of Geology.

Biography
Marcus Ross has loved paleontology (especially dinosaurs) since he was a kid growing up in Rhode Island. He has continued pursuing this passion, currently researching about a group of extinct marine reptiles called mosasaurs. He is greatly interested in issues surrounding the creation-evolution controversy and the intersection of geology with the Biblical events of creation and Noah's Flood. He and his wife Corinna live in Lynchburg, Virginia.

That's the way Liberty explains his interests on the university's website. He is now teaching his geology students at Liberty University that the Earth is less than 10,000 years old and that the Grand Canyon was formed by Noah's Flood. I kid you not!!!

Here is a blog that covers what he actually wrote in his dissertation and what he is now teaching and how he tries to explain himself. He went straight to the faculty at Liberty University after receiving his Ph.D. in geosciences from the University of Rhode Island. This is not a case of him changing his mind several years later.

This is the way one of his critics puts it:

Universities are no place for lies and deceit. You must stand up for what you believe and learn to defend it in an academic context. Otherwise, you don’t deserve a Ph.D.

Marcus Ross thinks it’s okay to write a thesis about 65 million year old reptiles when, in fact, he doesn’t believe a word of it. He justifies this by referring to “different paradigms.” Apparently, there’s one kind of “paradigm” when you are trying to get your Professors to give you a Ph.D. and another kind of “paradigm” at all other times. This is just a euphemism for “lying.” In this case, it’s lying for Jesus.

… It is not intellectually honest to write something in a thesis that you “know” to be incorrect. …

P.S. -- For anyone keeping score, I believe that makes a total of three fundies with Ph.D.'s in geoscience who proclaim a belief in young earth creationism. That's three in the entire world.

[Ninong]

Originally Posted by Qcks

It's amazing what people do for money.
Palentologists aren't known to be the richest people in the world, but i'll refrain from conjecture.

Actually it's Liberty University, not Regent. Same thing though, except that Jerry Falwell is dead and Pat Robertson is senile but not yet dead.

So Liberty gets to trot out their new kid in Geology with a Ph.D. from a real university who believes in Noah's Flood.

His new students should call him on his dissertation and ask him why he wrote it if he didn't believe any of it.

This is the goofy explanation according to the original NYT article:

For him, Dr. Ross said, the methods and theories of paleontology are one “paradigm” for studying the past, and Scripture is another. In the paleontological paradigm, he said, the dates in his dissertation are entirely appropriate. The fact that as a young earth creationist he has a different view just means, he said, “that I am separating the different paradigms.”

[Ninong]

It's official:

The world was created exactly 6,010 years ago according to the official Kingdom of Heaven website.

Note: Kingdom of Heaven passports and driver's licenses are now available online.

[Ninong]

While we're on the subject of dinosaurs and YEC whackos, what's up with "Dr. Dinosaur" (Kent Hovind)?

I checked his blog and he hasn't posted anything for the past 11 days. I became alarmed when I read a comment posted by one of his flock saying that she heard that the government was planning on sending him to a prison in a foreign country.

I just checked the Bureau of Prisons website to see it they had sent him to Gitmo but it looks like he's now enjoying the good life at the Federal Correctional Institution in Edgefield, South Carolina. I hope they gave him a pillow this time.

P.S. -- Bob Ney is at FCI Morgantown, WV.

Randy "Duke" Cunningham is at USP (United States Penitentiary) Tucson, Arizona. I wonder if they let Randy take one of his souvenir buck knives (with his picture on them) to prison? Probably not!

Jack Abramoff is at FCI Cumberland, Maryland. That's to keep him close to Washington, D.C. so the prosecutors don't have to travel far to listen to him sing.

David Safavian is not yet in BOP custody but he's in their computer.

[Ninong]

Oops!

Actor's Risque Past Halts 'Adam' Film

The man who plays Adam in a video aired at a Bible-based creationist museum has led a different life outside the Garden of Eden, flaunting his sexual exploits online and modeling for a clothing line that promotes free love.

After learning about his activities Thursday, the Creation Museum in Kentucky pulled the 40-second video in which he appears.

Eric Linden said he is very proud to play Adam. "But just because I'm Adam on the screen, that doesn't mean I'm Adam off the screen," he said. "What I do shouldn't have anything to do with who they think Adam is."

"For the Creation Museum, I did what I did as an actor. It doesn't necessarily mean I believe in evolution or I believe in creation," Linden said. "I'm hired to get a point across. On the flip side, if I was hired to play a murderer, that doesn't mean I'd go out and kill somebody. It's make-believe."

Yeah, right! They hired him to be an actor, not a spokesperson!



P.S. -- If Jeff Gannon is qualified to be the official spokesman for the International Bible Reading Association, why can't this dude play Adam in the Garden of Eden?

OK, after you click on that link (this dude), look at the very bottom of your computer screen to see what the sfx stands for.