[David]

Finally got my pond completed (summer project) and looking for site about koi, plants and pond care. Any help? TIA as always.

[Bojinx]

here is a nice site for plants and some other misc. supplies.

www.lilypons.com

Also, www.thatpetplace.com keeps some beautiful (and some expensive) koi in stock... as well as plants and any supply you may need.


btw... I would love to see some pics of your pond. If this is not possible, a description would be nice. We moved into a new house in February and the previous owners used to keep a pond. We did not set it up this year as I want to make a number of changes to it and as I was busy enough with other house stuff. We'll bring it up next spring though... (promised the wife )

[ranaman]

For Koi health see http://www.koivet.com He sells medications too of course alot of koi sites are listed as links. Really a must see site.

[David]

Bojinx- I just used those pre-fab rigid liners from hd. One has a spillway that flows into other with 500gph pump/filter returning water to upper section. Only about 320 gals total between the two. Lower pond has bell fountain, upper pond has one of those tacky ceramic goldfish 'spitting" return water into it and of course the spillway between the two, should provide plenty of airation. Lots of aquatic plants, floating and potted, all around. Also put in some of that barley straw. Hoping to avoid algae bloom with nutrient uptake by plants and barley straw. About two dozen feeder guppies and three small koi to start. Getting three more koi today and that's it for the winter, I'll let it settle until spring and then add more fish. For now all fish are contained in lower pond, upper pond is like "reverse" sump

thanks for site refernces

[Ninong]

David,

Here is another link for ya: http://www.koiusa.com/

Here is a bit of advice: Your setup is not adequate for any koi at all. It is far too small. Goldfish would be OK, but not koi.

Regards,

Ninong

[Bojinx]

Ouch... gotta agree with Ninong here David. 320gal is on the smallish size for a pond. While it would be fine for a few comets, shibukin, or other goldfish, your koi will quickly outgrow your setup.

I also plan on keeping several koi, that is why I opted to leave my pond down for this year. It is about 3200gal as it sits, and I plan on expanding and reshaping it for a total of around 4500-5000gal.

not trying to discourage... just some heads-up info.

[Bojinx]

Also, it seems like you are flowing alot of water. All info that I have read has told me to shoot for a flow rate of 1/4. So a 500gph flowrate would be great for a 2000gal pond. I'm not sure of the downsides (if any) of flowing too much water, but I'll try to look into it for you.

[Ninong]

To add a few more comments to this discussion, the problem that David faces is that his largest pond is actually 200 gallons, or less. It is probably no more than 18-20" deep. In his climate, this would be adequate for Goldfish because he will never face freezing weather. However, the problem with koi is that the physical size of the container is much too small to support them.

Koi are massive fish that grow very rapidly. One 6" koi is equal to ten 3" koi. One 12" koi is equal to 100 3" koi, and one 24" koi is equal to 1000 3" koi... based on mass. They also produce an enormous amount of waste. Koi should not even be attempted in anything less than 500 gallons that is at least 24" deep. That might work for a maximum of 3 fish but is really inadequate once they reach 12" or more in length. The usual minimum depth recommendation is 36" and most people consider that too shallow for koi.

When it comes to pond filtration, you have to distinguish between a pond that contains a few goldfish and lots of plants and a pond that is stocked with koi. There is a tremendous difference in the filtration requirements. For starters, you will find that koi present certain problems that have to be dealt with when it comes to plants in the pond. It can be done, but there are adjustments and compromises that have to be made. Koi can be very disruptive to plants. A turnover of 500gph is fine for the size setup that David has and is not too much except for the fact that water lilies do not like a lot of water movement... they prefer calm water. While a turnover of 500gph might work for a 2000-gal size natural style pond that contains lots of plants and not too many fish, it would be inadequate for a 2000-gal pond dedicated to koi. If you intend to lightly stock a koi pond and incorporate as much plant life as possible, you could get by with a turnover rate of 1/2 the pond volume per hour. If your intention is to concentrate on koi, your turnover rate would have to be at least one pond volume per hour.

The point is that you can have a very nice small pond, such as David has, you just can't keep koi in it. One of the problems faced with such small volumes of water is dealing with heat in the summer. The water temperature will rise into the 90's unless the pond is in complete shade. And if the pond is in complete shade, you can't keep water lilies.

Regards,

Ninong

[David]

All of above is greatly appreciated. Drat. I know you are all right about the thing being way too small for koi, I knew that from the start. I guess I was hoping to do a lot of turnover as they outgrow the pond. I put three 3" koi in there last weekend, I didn't get any more as I had planned. I will wait and see how quickly these three grow next season. I actually increased the water flow today by adding a Magnum 350 between the pond sections. It's not going to be permanent, just giving it a good cleaning after mucking around with planting yesterday. I guess I will have to be happy with goldfish. Bummer. This is all I had room for. Thanks again.

[Mikeman]

you guys might want to consider getting the book Ponder's Bible by Gosta Lovegren, great book,

last spring I was really serious about getting a pond but opted on making some changes on my reef tank,

that and to keep fish I would really need about a 3 foot deep pond, that's pretty deep, imo