[nick danger]

Has anyone seen the new Pet Warehouse catalog? It's now "Doctors Foster & Smith's" Pet Warehouse.

What gets me is that they are dressed up as a couple of MDs, complete with stethiscope. Do they stick the end under the water and say "Okay, fishies, take a deep breath!"

[PerryinCA]

They are a solid company who bought Pet Warehouse, and the owners are practising D.V.M.'s. They have a knowledgable staff, some of whom were at MACNA this year. I wouldn't hesistate to buy from them.

-Perry

[Reefland]

They seem to be taking over everything, also recently aquiring e-tropicals.

Scott Z.

[Ninong]

Originally posted by PerryinCA
They have a knowledgable staff, some of whom were at MACNA this year.

Perry,

You might want to point out to one of their knowledgeable staff members that the picture on page 77 of their current catalogue that they have identified as "Staghorn Coral" is most certainly not a staghorn coral. It is an Acropora but it is definitely not a staghorn.

Also, on page 76 they make the following statement about their "Assorted Koi -- Domestic" --

"Minimum pond capacity is 250 gallons." That is a cruel joke to play on some novice customer. The absolute minimum depth of a pond for koi is 3 feet. A better minimum dept is 4 feet and an ideal depth is 6 feet. Any koi placed in a 250 gallon pond would have to be relocated within a year or two. Their growth would be stunted in such a small pond but they would continue to grow, but at a slower rate. It is a mistake to try to keep koi in anthing less than 750 gallons and even that is really too small if you intend to keep more than two or three fish and if you want them to grow to 24" or more.

Then they make the absurd claim: "Grows up to 48"." And that's right after they claimed a minimum pond capacity of only 250 gallons. There has never been a 48" koi; not here and not even in Japan. There are a very few 95 cm koi in Japan, but they are extremely rare. No koi has ever reached 48" in length and most in this country will never reach 36" in length, even under ideal conditions.

I have a problem with the advertising claims that they make in their ad copy. A few years ago, when I didn't know any better, I ordered a pond filter with built-in UV lamp that they claimed was ideal for koi ponds up to 6,000 gallons!! (That's when they were still Pet Warehouse.) When the filter arrived I found the following chart printed on the side of the box: OK for 6,000 gallon ponds with no fish load if located in full shade; OK for 3,000 gallon ponds with light goldfish load if located in full shade; OK for 1,500 gallon ponds with light koi load if located in full shade. Then they cautioned that those figures would have to be reduced drastically if the pond were located in full sun. Of course, you need full sun if you want to grow water lilies. The only good thing about this story is that they were happy to have me return the product for full refund and even paid the return UPS charges when I pointed out to them that their ad copy was grossly misleading. They did not, however, change their ad copy.

They have repeatedly made mistakes in their lighting section ad copy that they have refused to correct even after the errors were pointed out to them. We had a rather lengthy thread on RC recently that was started by a member who purchased a 400w metal halide lamp from them that they advertised as 10,000K. It was not 10,000K. Not even close. It was actually 5200K. The manufacturer identified it as "Daylight" and the "lighting expert" at Drs. Foster & Smith determined that "Daylight" is "the same thing as 10,000K." Therefore they decided to advertise it as 10,000K. Nowhere in the manufacturer's description was this lamp called 10,000K; in fact, a check of the product code on the carton against the manufacturer's website confirmed that it was actually 5200K. Even after we pointed this out to Drs. Foster & Smith, they continued to advertise it as 10,000K, only they increased the price by $10 and added the words: "Final Clearance."

[PerryinCA]

Ninong,

Many biologists loosely call all branching acropora growth types staghorn. Silly, but I learned this in a Marine Bio class at bezerkely. In any case....I don't have a copy of the catalog, so if its a plating type, that obviously wouldn't apply.

I know for a fact they often use the ad copy from the manufacturer when they are creating the catalog. If they are provided bogus information, its likely thats whats printed.

Now the lighting thing, I have to wonder who that was, but from the guys I have talked to have been rather informed. Then again, I have never spoke to anyone in customer service. If thats true, its ridiculous. I did see eddies thread, and think that needs to be changed to the proper k rating (or at least something more realistic).

-Perry

[Ninong]

Well, in the case of Drs. Foster & Smith, they loosely call ALL of their Acropora corals Staghorn: http://www.liveaquaria.com/product/s...=22&pCatId=322

[Ninong]

Perry,

In the case of Eddie's thread, they should have changed it to the actual Kelvin rating claimed by the manufacturer. We gave them all of the information, including the manufacturer's website where the manufacturer clearly lists the Kelvin rating for that product number as 5200K. They did not get the 10,000K figure from anything in the manufacturer's documentation or from anything printed on the carton. They invented it out of thin air. And they admit that. Their position is that their "lighting expert" thinks that "Daylight means 10,000K and since the carton reads 'Daylight,' it is perfectly OK to advertise it as 10,000K."

Of course, it is interesting that after we pointed out to them that a true 10,000K lamp costs twice as much as their advertised price, they raised their price by $10 and marked it "Final Clearance."

[Ninong]

Just out of curiosity I decided to revisit the Drs. Foster & Smith website to see if they ever corrected their ad copy on the BLV Topflood 400w 5200K metal halide lamps (BLV product code 227111) that they shipped to Eddie as 10,000K.

They did make some changes but, as usual, their ad copy still contains significant errors: http://www.drsfostersmith.com/produc...=6&pCatId=8237

They have left the price at $59.99 (up from the original $49.99 when they were claiming 10,000K), they have dropped the name Topflood (which appeared in the original copy and is actually the correct model name used by BLV), they have changed the Kelvin rating from 10,000K to the correct 5200K but they continue to claim that these lamps are "manufactured" by Giesemann (not true).

They continue to claim that they have something called the "Nova 150 Ultramarine bulb" for the bargain price of only $249.99, which is a complete joke. There is no such thing as a Nova 150 Ultramarine bulb and, even if there were, they wouldn't sell very many for $249.99 each. As I mentioned in Eddie's thread on RC, they probably found a few Giesemann Nova II fixtures laying around in the back of the warehouse and are unable to read the cartons correctly. Ultramarine is the name of one of the colors that fixture comes in and Pet Warehouse used to advertise them without the bulbs so that they would look like a bargain. They charged separately for the bulbs.

Also, they are trying to peddle 6800K 150w double-end bulbs for $99.99 each even though they also sell 10,000K 150w double-end bulbs for only $79.99 each and 10,000K 250w double-end bulbs for only $85.99 each. All of those are manufactured by BLV and the 10,000K bulbs should be more expensive than the 6800K. Their ad copy on the 10,000K and 20,000K double-ended bulbs now reads "German made" instead of "manufactured by Giesemann" as it incorrectly claimed when I ordered mine.

So their "knowledgeable staff" members have a long way to go before anyone would take them seriously.

[Reinhold]

Ninong:

Take a deep breath.....count to 10.....take a Xanax.

Someone who didn't know you as the light-hearted, fun-loving guy you are could think you were a cranky old fart.

[Ninong]

But I am.

It always upsets me to see the same attitude from so many vendors, whether online or LFS. Anything to make a buck and no interest in taking care of their customers. Do you think for one minute that Drs. Foster & Smith contacted any of the customers who purchased what was advertised as 10,000K 400w lamps to inform them that they were really only 5200K and offer to replace them? I seriously doubt it because they argued with us that we didn't know what we were talking about. They even claimed to have double checked the matter with their so-called "lighting expert," who insisted that "Daylight" means 10,000K. Some expert.

Do you remember all the pics of chartreuse colored tanks a couple of years back? Those were lit with "6500K" 400w Iwasaki lamps that turned out to be only 4300K. Some online vendors were shipping the 4300K lamps and advertising them as 6500K. One of the moderators on this board had those over his tank. When he contacted the online vendor who sold them to him, he was told he was out of luck. They refused to replace them even though he could prove to them that they were only 4300K based on the manufacturer's product code. That was why there was so much confusion 18 months ago about what a tank with 400w 6500K Iwasaki lamps really looked like. Some tanks looked very greenish-yellow and others looked only barely yellowish-white and all were supposedly using 400w 6500K Iwasaki lamps.

And it would take me the rest of the week to detail all of the outright lies and misinformation that I have encountered at LFS, both here and elsewhere. I have personally witnessed the owner of an LFS recommending the purchase of two Flame Angels to a novice reefkeeper who came in to replace a couple of the "cycling" damsels that didn't make it through the new tank cycle; four of the six damsels survived the process but two did not. However, since he told the LFS owner that it was about two weeks since the last damsel passed away, he was told that it would be OK now to add a couple of angels. No need to buy any more of those cheapy damsels. Flame Angels at $42 each would be a much better choice.

[wgscott]

I've often wondered about the ignorance/stupidity/dishonesty/greed four-dimensional trade-off matrix.

My LFS seems to react with disappointment when I tell them that fish I bought 3 or 4 years ago are all still alive and well. I only have 5 fish. That really seems to cheeze them off way more than me buying my lighting on the internet for a few buck fewer.

The problem is that there is a BIG profit incentive for them to do this.

Capitalism doesn't mix well with salt-water in some cases.

It is one thing if someone rips you off with the wrong light bulbs. It is quite another if they intentionally kill animals with their greedy bad advice.

[Ninong]

WG,

Here is another example of Drs. Foster & Smith using misleading ad copy to sell their products:

On page 61 of their current catalogue they make the following claims about the Azoo AquaHalide Lighting fixtures that are supplied with 150w 20,000K DE metal halides and 9w Blue PCs ~~

"Designed especially for freshwater and reef aquariums, its color temperature is close to the solar spectrum."

Its color temperature is not close to the solar spectrum and the only freshwater aquariums it would be suitable for would be those with no live plants. But at least they didn't say anything about live plants, did they? Clever.