Wellstone Memorial Service/Rally

**Ninong** · 11-01-2002, 09:58 AM

WG,

I don't want to start sounding Republican (perish the thought), but there is such a thing as too much government. Legislation such as this is something George Orwell didn't even dream of. Or did he? Maybe they should stick with referenda on their nuclear policy and other important foreign policy matters befitting a Peoples Republic and not legislate every little aspect of the daily lives of the citizenry.

What's next, Thought Police?

wgscott · 11-02-2002, 11:06 PM

Having been simultaneously registered with the Republican Party and living in Berkeley (and I voted for Pat Buchhanan intentionally back then in order to maximize chaos), I am probably uniquely unqualified to answer this question. I think the average Berkeley-ite would say this sort of thing is decided for us all of the time, and so heavily in the opposite direction, that it a purely symbolic gesture.

Unlike a lot of the goofiness in Berkeley, this one actually has some legitimacy, given the connection between, for example, Death Squads in Colombia (heavily financed by Clinton and Bush) and the coffee-growers. If you try to unionize the coffee-pickers, you will have a tag on your big toe and be horizontal on a piece of stainless steel pretty quickly. So if I were in Berkeley, I would vote for the measure because of this. I didn't drink any coffee when I lived there; I only started about two years ago when I realized I would never get any sleep ever again until I die.

wgscott · 11-02-2002, 11:11 PM

I know I am not in a good position to do this, but I do have to point out, Ninong, that you have misspelled Colombia.

**Ninong** · 11-02-2002, 11:37 PM

You only caught it because you probably taught there (Columbia not Colombia) before you moved to California.

Besides, I didn't actually misspell it, I just Anglicized it.

wgscott · 11-03-2002, 12:12 AM

I was offered a job there just before... did I tell you this? If not, that is really creepy. What else do you know about me? Maybe I shouldn't ask...

**Ninong** · 11-03-2002, 09:05 AM

You mentioned it in a post a couple of years ago. We don't have that thread anymore because we lost all the old stuff when we changed the board's software. Don't you remember the thread in which I posted a picture of the new subsidized housing that Stanford was putting up? They were offering new 1-BR apts to faculty and staff for something like $800-$900/mo, in Palo Alto!!

**schrocat** · 11-03-2002, 09:31 AM

Quote:

did I tell you this? If not, that is really creepy. What else do you know about me? Maybe I shouldn't ask...

I have wg cam kicking right now!

Nice shirt!

**Ninong** · 11-03-2002, 06:27 PM

So alarmed are Starbucks, Peet's and the National Coffee Association that they each had spent at least $10,000 as of the latest filing period to defeat the measure.

Their biggest thrust so far is a glossy mailer sent to Berkeley households this week showing a man being led away in handcuffs by police.

"The crime: serving the wrong kind of coffee," the ad says. "The punishment: six months in jail."

wgscott · 11-03-2002, 09:28 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ninong
You mentioned it in a post a couple of years ago. We don't have that thread anymore because we lost all the old stuff when we changed the board's software. Don't you remember the thread in which I posted a picture of the new subsidized housing that Stanford was putting up? They were offering new 1-BR apts to faculty and staff for something like $800-$900/mo, in Palo Alto!!

Ok, I remember now.

wgscott · 11-03-2002, 09:29 PM

Quote:

"The punishment: six months in jail."

If that part is true it is unlikely to pass.

**Ninong** · 11-03-2002, 10:08 PM

Yes, that part IS true but it is highly unlikely that anyone would actually be sentenced to jail unless they dared the judge. And exactly how would they enforce such an ordinance anyway? It sounds more like a feel-good political statement to me.

**Ninong** · 11-06-2002, 09:02 AM

Measure O was the brainchild of attorney Rick Young, who graduated last year from UC Berkeley's Boalt Hall School of Law. He was prompted by destruction of the rain forests, the dangers of pesticides, and the crisis in the world coffee industry, which is seeing millions of peasant coffee farmers pushed into dire poverty.

It was strongly opposed by the coffee industry, particularly Peet's, Starbucks and the National Coffee Association, which provided nearly all the funds for the anti-O campaign.

The opposition targeted the penalties for violating the law. It would have been a misdemeanor, punishable by a fine of up to $100 and/or a jail term up to six months.

The anti-O campaign blanketed Berkeley households with a glossy mailer last week showing a man being led away in handcuffs. It said, ""Does the punishment fit the crime?''

Berkeley's Prop. O, the Coffee Measure, was defeated 70% to 30%.

Reinhold · 11-06-2002, 09:10 AM

Well, the Democratic pep rally that was the Paul Wellstone "Memorial" service was directly responsible for the loss of the Senate seat in Minnesota.

By a 2:1 margin, Minnesotans decried the pep rally, and it showed at the polls.

Norm Coleman has been declared the winner of the Senate race by several Minneapolis TV stations, and Mondale supposedly will concede at 0900 today.

**Ninong** · 11-06-2002, 09:23 AM

You're probably right about that. And it looks like the Republicans have won the Senate race in South Dakota, too.

I have them at 52 seats right now (assuming SD goes to the Republican candidate) with Louisiana to be determined in a runoff on Dec. 7th. We have a crazy system down here. Mary Landrieu received only 47% of the vote, so she will face the second place finisher in a runoff election. She ran against 8 opponents, including 3 Republicans. She may or may not win in the runoff. It will be close, even though her closest opponent drew only 27% yesterday.

Except for Arkansas, the Democrats lost virtually all of the senate races they thought they had a good chance of winning and they lost one, Georgia, that they didn't think was really in play.

**Ninong** · 11-06-2002, 09:42 AM

The polls and the pundits were off on this election big time. They were not off by much but they were off across the board all across the country.

Maybe we would have been better off watching the stock market yesterday if we wanted to know what was about to happen. The NASDAQ was down and the Dow was just barely up around 1 p.m. New York time. A 1/4 point rate cut at today's FOMC meeting had been factored in for days, but then around 1:20 p.m. New York time rumors hit the floor that the Republicans were privately predicting that they would retake the senate and the market turned around with the Dow ending up triple digits.

11-01-2002, 09:58 AM	#21
Ninong Moderator Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Louisiana Posts: 20,691	WG, I don't want to start sounding Republican (perish the thought), but there is such a thing as too much government. Legislation such as this is something George Orwell didn't even dream of. Or did he? Maybe they should stick with referenda on their nuclear policy and other important foreign policy matters befitting a Peoples Republic and not legislate every little aspect of the daily lives of the citizenry. What's next, Thought Police? __________________ Ninong

11-02-2002, 11:37 PM	#24
Ninong Moderator Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Louisiana Posts: 20,691	You only caught it because you probably taught there (Columbia not Colombia) before you moved to California. Besides, I didn't actually misspell it, I just Anglicized it. __________________ Ninong

11-03-2002, 09:05 AM	#26
Ninong Moderator Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Louisiana Posts: 20,691	You mentioned it in a post a couple of years ago. We don't have that thread anymore because we lost all the old stuff when we changed the board's software. Don't you remember the thread in which I posted a picture of the new subsidized housing that Stanford was putting up? They were offering new 1-BR apts to faculty and staff for something like $800-$900/mo, in Palo Alto!! __________________ Ninong

11-03-2002, 06:27 PM	#28
Ninong Moderator Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Louisiana Posts: 20,691	Berkeley's Prop. O Update So alarmed are Starbucks, Peet's and the National Coffee Association that they each had spent at least $10,000 as of the latest filing period to defeat the measure. Their biggest thrust so far is a glossy mailer sent to Berkeley households this week showing a man being led away in handcuffs by police. "The crime: serving the wrong kind of coffee," the ad says. "The punishment: six months in jail." __________________ Ninong

11-03-2002, 10:08 PM	#31
Ninong Moderator Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Louisiana Posts: 20,691	Yes, that part IS true but it is highly unlikely that anyone would actually be sentenced to jail unless they dared the judge. And exactly how would they enforce such an ordinance anyway? It sounds more like a feel-good political statement to me. __________________ Ninong

11-02-2002, 11:06 PM	#22
wgscott Governor Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: CA, USA Posts: 1,240	Having been simultaneously registered with the Republican Party and living in Berkeley (and I voted for Pat Buchhanan intentionally back then in order to maximize chaos), I am probably uniquely unqualified to answer this question. I think the average Berkeley-ite would say this sort of thing is decided for us all of the time, and so heavily in the opposite direction, that it a purely symbolic gesture. Unlike a lot of the goofiness in Berkeley, this one actually has some legitimacy, given the connection between, for example, Death Squads in Colombia (heavily financed by Clinton and Bush) and the coffee-growers. If you try to unionize the coffee-pickers, you will have a tag on your big toe and be horizontal on a piece of stainless steel pretty quickly. So if I were in Berkeley, I would vote for the measure because of this. I didn't drink any coffee when I lived there; I only started about two years ago when I realized I would never get any sleep ever again until I die.

11-02-2002, 11:11 PM	#23
wgscott Governor Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: CA, USA Posts: 1,240	I know I am not in a good position to do this, but I do have to point out, Ninong, that you have misspelled Colombia.

11-03-2002, 12:12 AM	#25
wgscott Governor Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: CA, USA Posts: 1,240	I was offered a job there just before... did I tell you this? If not, that is really creepy. What else do you know about me? Maybe I shouldn't ask...

11-06-2002, 09:02 AM	#32
Ninong Moderator Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Louisiana Posts: 20,691	Berkeley's Coffee Measure Down the Drain Measure O was the brainchild of attorney Rick Young, who graduated last year from UC Berkeley's Boalt Hall School of Law. He was prompted by destruction of the rain forests, the dangers of pesticides, and the crisis in the world coffee industry, which is seeing millions of peasant coffee farmers pushed into dire poverty. It was strongly opposed by the coffee industry, particularly Peet's, Starbucks and the National Coffee Association, which provided nearly all the funds for the anti-O campaign. The opposition targeted the penalties for violating the law. It would have been a misdemeanor, punishable by a fine of up to $100 and/or a jail term up to six months. The anti-O campaign blanketed Berkeley households with a glossy mailer last week showing a man being led away in handcuffs. It said, ""Does the punishment fit the crime?'' Berkeley's Prop. O, the Coffee Measure, was defeated 70% to 30%. __________________ Ninong

11-06-2002, 09:10 AM	#33
Reinhold Mayor Join Date: May 2001 Location: USA Posts: 941	The Rally Bit Them in the Butt! Well, the Democratic pep rally that was the Paul Wellstone "Memorial" service was directly responsible for the loss of the Senate seat in Minnesota. By a 2:1 margin, Minnesotans decried the pep rally, and it showed at the polls. Norm Coleman has been declared the winner of the Senate race by several Minneapolis TV stations, and Mondale supposedly will concede at 0900 today.

11-06-2002, 09:23 AM	#34
Ninong Moderator Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Louisiana Posts: 20,691	You're probably right about that. And it looks like the Republicans have won the Senate race in South Dakota, too. I have them at 52 seats right now (assuming SD goes to the Republican candidate) with Louisiana to be determined in a runoff on Dec. 7th. We have a crazy system down here. Mary Landrieu received only 47% of the vote, so she will face the second place finisher in a runoff election. She ran against 8 opponents, including 3 Republicans. She may or may not win in the runoff. It will be close, even though her closest opponent drew only 27% yesterday. Except for Arkansas, the Democrats lost virtually all of the senate races they thought they had a good chance of winning and they lost one, Georgia, that they didn't think was really in play. __________________ Ninong

11-06-2002, 09:42 AM	#35
Ninong Moderator Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Louisiana Posts: 20,691	The polls and the pundits were off on this election big time. They were not off by much but they were off across the board all across the country. Maybe we would have been better off watching the stock market yesterday if we wanted to know what was about to happen. The NASDAQ was down and the Dow was just barely up around 1 p.m. New York time. A 1/4 point rate cut at today's FOMC meeting had been factored in for days, but then around 1:20 p.m. New York time rumors hit the floor that the Republicans were privately predicting that they would retake the senate and the market turned around with the Dow ending up triple digits. __________________ Ninong

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