[ddangg]

Hi,

I'm looking into buying the AB Aquaspace light, with 3 x 250W HQI lamps plus 4 24W PC's. Does anyone have one of these? If so, I'd appreciate your thoughts.

Thanks,

Dan

[ronjon]

jakedad and i have ordered the fixture that u mention. we have not recieved them yet. i can maybe post up pics and comment on the fixture but i got to get it first. ninong is a moderator here and has a similar fixture. he's proably the most qualified to comment so look for him to post up some useful information soon. welcome to the boards btw. hey, do a search in the lighting section for HQI and you should be able to pull up some good reading at any rate.

regards,
rj

[theringnebula]

I'll copy and paste what I posted on another board:

HQI's ROCK!! The Best Light Ever!

I have to say that I have finally seen the light! (no pun intended). I went over to my friends house tonight who just got their new Aqualine Buschke AquaSpacelight with 3x250 Watt HQI's and 4x24Watt Blue PC's and I have to say that it is hands down the best looking lighting I have ever seen!!

I can't imagine any other alternative after seeing this. I feel that this lighting would please just about anyone. Here are my thoughts:

The color was absolutely the best I've seen. It was absolutely totally white with absolutely no yellow or green at all. The Color rendition was fabulous. All colors of the rainbow were present here in close to their true form (not distorted like bulbs that are way to blue or yellow). I have seen Iwasaki's and have found them to be unpleasant looking but this was just perfect. I also think that most MH bulb that advertise as 10,000k are just not bright enough and/or they are way too blue to be true 10,000k. Not too blue, not too yellow. I was worried that the 4x24 PC's wouldn't be enough but believe me the color is perfect (now I know why most of these HQI systems come with little or no supp. blue lighting --- they don't need it).

They seemed very intense. I don't think I have yet to see a system that looked more intense than this (of course visual observation doesn't necc. mean anything)

As for the unit itself it is very nice looking. Very slimline and sleek. It actually looks good

At any rate I am ordering one of these system ASAP for my new reef... I can't imagine any other light after seeing it.

Wes

[ddangg]

Wes,

What size tank was the light on? I've read that the light coverage from each HQI lamp is only about 20" x 20". Since the foot print of my tank is 72" x 24", I'm a little concerned. Is there any chance that you can post a picture of your friends tank lit by the Aquaspacelight?

Thanks,

Dan

[theringnebula]

This was on a 200 gal oceanic 84 x 24 x 24 and the coverage was excellent. It's really a top notch system. There was not a dim spot in the tank. The unit is designed to hang 8-10 inches from the surface and this will ensure total coverage.

I don't have any pics... but if this system disappointed you I would be totally shocked as it was just amazing... I mean I haven't been totally happy with any lighting system I've seen (this ones too yellow, this onws too blue, this ones not bright enough) but this was literally the way I had always wanted to see reef lighting.

You could tell IMMEDIATELY that there was something special about this lighting. It is like nothing I've seen before and Ive seen a lot of lighting setups.

Wes

P.S. I was asking all the same questions as you but when I saw this unit it layed to rest any aprehension I had about it

[Ninong]

Hi Dan ~

Let me see if I can clear up some of your questions. The comment you may have read about a 250w HQI double-ended lamp only covering an area 20"x20" was probably posted by someone who has a PFO mini-hood mounted inside their canopy only 5" above the surface. We have a couple of members on this board (JG and Golfish) who have just such an arrangement and I'm sure that they would agree with that assessment. However, their lamps are mounted too close to the surface to provide proper light spread. According to the manufacturer, AB-Aqualine, their fixtures must be suspended 30cm (12") above the surface in order to insure proper light spread and to prevent the fixture from heating the aquarium water. Personally, I believe 8" or 9" may be sufficient to accomplish this. Incidentally, although I was unable to get light spread figures from the AB-Aqualine website, Giesemann does give these figures for their fixtures on their German website: 27.6"x23.6" or to be precise 70x60cm is what they claim the coverage is for either a 150w or 250w HQI double-ended lamp in one of their fixtures which means the lamp is mounted parallel to the front of the tank, same as the Aquaspacelight--the 27.6" dimension is along the long dimension of the tank and the 23.6" dimension is front-to-back, or width of the tank.

One of our other members, Susan, has a 168-gal tank that measures 60"Lx24"Wx27"H that is lit by a 48" long AB-Aqualine Aquastarlight fixture with 2x250w 10,000K HQI double-ended lamps. She has her fixture suspended about 12" above the surface and it evenly covers the entire tank. I believe that you will have no problems at all covering a 72" long tank with the 72" long Aquaspacelight fixture with 3x250w 10,000K HQI double-ended lamps plus the 4x24w Osram actinic PCs, provided that your fixture is not suspended too close to the surface. Certainly you will be OK at 12" above the surface and you will probably be OK at 8" or 9" above the surface.

These fixtures are quite heavy. The fixture you are considering weighs exactly 49.2-lbs. This is because the ballasts are enclosed in the fixture. They come with steel cables and other suspension hardware. They are quite attractive and have a higher quality finish than many other fixtures I have seen.

Another thing to remember about these AB-10000 HQI lamps is that according to AB-Aqualine the actual color of these lamps is 13,000K (AB-10000 is just the "brand name"). Last week we had a member from the UK who posted that AB-Aqualine does not actually manufacture their own lamps. I am confused by that as I always thought that they did. Maybe someone else will chime in with an opinion on that. I know that Giesemann doesn't manufacture their own lamps, but I always thought that AB did. When you get into the area of color temperature ratings claimed by manufacturers, you are in murky waters indeed. Just look at the apparent color of the ALS 12,000K lamps compared with the Ushio/BLV 10,000K HQI double-ended lamp which tested at 11,723K (according to Sanjay Joshi) and the AB-10000 HQI double-ended lamp which the manufacturer says is actually 13,000K. The ALS 12,000K lamp is obviously very blue compared to these other two lamps and has a lot less PAR.

Personally, I believe you will be very pleased with the Aquaspacelight fixture you are considering provided you are interested in a fixture suspended above your tank. These fixtures would be difficult to enclose in any sort of canopy due to heat issues. They are designed to radiate heat upwards. Since they have double-ended HQI lamps, they have a UV shield; and since they have HQI double-ended lamps they cannot have ventilation fans inside the hood blowing on the lamps.

Ninong

[theringnebula]

Ninong:

I wouldn't be surprised if Aqualine's bulbs are made by Ushio and just repackaged in Aqualine Boxes. A few people have said they can't tell the difference.

[Ninong]

Well, I have both the 250w AB-10000 HQI double-ended lamps and the 250w Ushio/BLV 10,000K HQI double-ended lamps and the construction is definitely different.

Ninong

[Mandarin1]

Is there a website for these lights or a online store that sells them any way of seeing what they look like and cost is appreciated thanks
Keith

[Ninong]

Originally posted by Mandarin1
Is there a website for these lights or a online store that sells them any way of seeing what they look like and cost is appreciated thanks
Keith

If you want to see exactly what a double-ended lamp looks like, here is the Ushio catalogue, go to page 20: http://www.ushio.com/files/gi_catalog.pdf

If you would like to see what the Aquaspacelight fixtures look like, here is AB-Aqualine's website: www.ab-aqualine.de

The AB-Aqualine fixtures are available whereever you find a vendor who carries Aqua-Medic products (same company). One online source that several members of this board have used to order these fixtures is www.customaquatic.com They can get you any of the AB-Aqualine fixtures, even if they do not list all of them on their site. I don't see the Aquaspacelight listed on their site right now but they do sell them. I believe the 6-ft fixture with 3x250w HQI plus 4x24w PCs is approximately $1100.

The 150w and 250w 10,000K double-ended metal halide lamps are available at several online vendors. Right now, the cheapest price seems to be www.petwhse.com which offers the Ushio/BLV 150w for $80 and the 250w for $85.

Ninong

[ddangg]

Hi,

Thanks for all of your replies, they've helped clear up a lot of questions for me. If you don't mind a couple more...

I haven't been able to find a vendor for 24W PC bulbs, does anyone know where these are available? Also, since the AB lights come from europe, can someone tell me if the ones sent to the states come wired to handle US current, or do they need to be modified?

Thanks again, you've all made my choice much easier.

Dan

[theringnebula]

If you order it from a US Vendor it will come wired for the US and not europe. As for the bulbs that is a good question. I will ask my friend who has the light.

Note: This unit is approx 850 Watts and will use around 7-8 amps so make sure your circuit is not already too loaded.

[Ninong]

Dan, it looks like Wes has already answered your question about wiring so I'll answer the part about replacement 24w PC lamps: Custom Aquatic carries 24w PC lamps in both actinic and 50/50 (half actinic, half daylight). These are not Osram lamps but they are German pin configuration so they would work. http://www.customaquatic.com/detailc...bCatID=lt-rpcb

I don't know if any of the online vendors who are selling the Aquaspacelight are yet carrying the original equipment Osram 24w blue power compact fluorescents. I see no reason why you can't use another brand 24w PC as long as it has the proper pin configuration. You can also use either the AB-10000 original equipment HQI lamp or the Ushio/BLV HQI lamp.

Regards,

Ninong

[billzie]

Ninong,
50#, e-gads! One of the LFS employees in Chicago just ordered one of these fixs, 250w X 1, it was heavy as well. I expected that it uses trad. tar/coil ballast. We thought that if this were the case, other than the nice fix it wouldn't be worth the cost in the long run, elec cost, bulb life expectancy, etc.
Let me know if I'm wrong on the ballast ??.
After, seeing the fix first hand and the weight of it (assuming tar/coil), I've decided to go with some (?mfg) electronic ballast HQI setup.
Bill.

[Ninong]

Originally posted by billzie

Ninong,
50#, e-gads!

The 6-ft length Aquaspacelight with 3*250w HQI plus 4*24w PC actinics weighs that much--actually only 49.2 lbs. I have a 4-ft length Aquastarlight Future with 2*250w HQI plus 25w blue incandescent moonlight and it weighs 35.3 lbs.

One of the LFS employees in Chicago just ordered one of these fixs, 250w X 1, it was heavy as well.

Nah! That one weighs only about 20 lbs.

I expected that it uses trad. tar/coil ballast.

Yes.

After, seeing the fix first hand and the weight of it (assuming tar/coil), I've decided to go with some (?mfg) electronic ballast HQI setup.

Hmmm... one little tiny problem. The top of the line German HQI fixtures that do employ electronic ballasts cost approximately 3 times as much. What you could do is use the individual PFO mini-hoods--like Golfish and JG--and hook them up to Ice Cap electronic ballasts (the regular Ice Cap 250w MH ballast will run HQI). This would have the advantage of saving a little on electrical consumption (I think) and they would not generate ballast heat. However, you won't save any money overall with this approach because three individual mini-hoods plus three Ice Cap ballasts will run well over double the cost of a comparable Aquaspacelight fixture.

If you do decide to go with the individual mini-hoods, be sure to mount them at least 8"-9" above the surface or you won't get proper light spread. You will need strong ventilation inside your canopy with these. It is very difficult to try to DIY with HQI double-ended lamps for two reasons: (1) they absolutely must have a UV shield, and (2) you cannot have ventilation fans blowing on exposed HQI double-ended lamps.

Believe me, I researched this thing to death! My first choice, by far, was the Giesemann System 260 Moonlight but it is extremely expensive over here. If you can deal with a very heavy suspended fixture, you will find that the AB-Aqualine fixtures cannot be beat for price if you are determined to go with 250w HQI double-ended lamps.

Ninong

[billzie]

The IC dual 250w HQI from Reefers comes with ballast, bulbs, mini hoods, and harness for $580. Would this word out to 3 times as much? I know, the actinic would cost me about $100 to retro, but I have this already.
The unit I saw at LFS was $600 AB 250w X 1.
Have I been misinformed? I've seen the claim that elec. ballast HQI bulbs have 50% longer lifespan, about 18months.
I've seen an AB fixture shell for sale at Champion, anyone know if they still have them?
Bill.

[Ninong]

Originally posted by billzie

The IC dual 250w HQI from Reefers comes with ballast, bulbs, mini hoods, and harness for $580.

First of all, I believe you may be confused with the Ice Cap dual 150w HQI rig. Ice Cap used to make a dual 150w HQI ballast which is probably still available at a few online sources (maybe) but they never did make a dual 250w HQI ballast. The price you are quoting seems to me to be what Reefers used to offer the dual 150w rig for when they still sold dry goods. BTW, Brian Griffin no longer sells dry goods at all. Check it out: http://www.acropora.com/

If memory serves me (and it usually does ), he used to offer the single 250w HQI double-ended lamp with Ice Cap ballast for $429. That would be $1287 for 3 mini-hood rigs. You would then have to add the cost of a canopy, or fixture, to accomodate these separate mini-hoods. You would also have to add the cost of PC actinics if you wanted to duplicate the Aquaspacelight fixture. The 6-ft Aquaspacelight fixture with 3*250w HQI lamps and 4*24w PC actinics is $999 at Custom Aquatics.

Would this word out to 3 times as much?

It would probably work out to close to twice as much. The three times as much applies to a Giesemann System 260 Moonlight fixture which would cost approximately $3000 in the 6-ft length IF it were available in the U.S. The 4-ft Giesemann System 260 Moonlight fixture IS available over here for $2300.

The unit I saw at LFS was $600 AB 250w X 1.

That is very expensive. I paid less than $700 for my Aquastarlight Future 4-ft fixture with 2*250w HQI plus moonlight.


Have I been misinformed? I've seen the claim that elec. ballast HQI bulbs have 50% longer lifespan, about 18months.

I really don't know about that. I know that on a regular ballast the manufacturer claims that the lifespan is 18 months but then goes on to recommend that they be replaced at 14 months. I have seen reports that the Ice Cap electronic ballasts greatly extend the life of VHO fluorescent lamps and I believe I read a report a couple of years back that claimed the same thing for the 150w HQI lamp (actually, it claimed an 18-mo usable life). Ice Cap has been working on a single 150w HQI ballast for several months now but I believe it is still in the testing phase. Their regular 250w MH ballast will power 250w HQI lamps and I assume that it might extend the usable life of the lamp, but that is just a guess.

I've seen an AB fixture shell for sale at Champion, anyone know if they still have them?

That was the old style Aquastarlight Classic shell in 120cm (4-ft) length. I believe they may have sold their remaining inventory of those since they no longer list those on their site.

Ninong

[PerryinCA]

Hey Ninong,

Sanjay told me to expect similar life from an HQI as a Iwasaki. He said he wasn't totally sure, but he didn't see any reason not to.

He changes his 400w MH Iwasaki's every two years.

I run the Icecap ballasts (4 over my 90, one on the 55), and don't think its any secret that I love them. I have play with all the AB lights though, and they seem to be high quality. If I had the ability to hang it from the roof, I might have done that. Also, the flexibility of the Icecap setup will allow use on a wide variety of tanks. If you plan on having only one tank, and never switching, thats not a problem.

The PFO HQI setups are available as well, but they tend to be alot bigger/heavier, and draw more amps(only the ballast, everything else is the same). But, the PFO stuff is well made.

[Ninong]

Perry ~

The PFO custom fixtures (like the one that SPASSE has) are very well made. I have seen some Hamilton fixtures and some CSL fixtures that I didn't think were of comparable quality to the AB-Aqualine fixtures.

One thing to remember about running your metal halide lamps for a long time before changing them is that you will have a considerable difference in intensity for your animals to adjust to when you finally get around to replacing the lamps. I know some people don't mind letting them run down to 70% of their original output but that sounds like a big adjustment to me. The article I read a couple of years back on the 150w 10,000K HQI TS lamp claimed 18-24 months useful life, but I don't remember what ballast was used for that claim. Everything that I have read about these lamps in the 250w size tends to point in the direction of 12-13 months if your metal halides are on 12 hrs per day and 14-15 months if they are on only 10 hrs per day. You can add about two months to those figures for the 150w size which seem to last a little longer. That's based on using a regular ballast, not an electronic ballast. I have read reports of hobbyists going 2 years before changing them but I think that's pushing it.

Of course, Sanjay has access to all the testing equipment and he has actually run tests on used 400w 6500K Iwasaki lamps, so I certainly won't argue with anything he has to say on the subject.

Ninong