[Aquariust]

Hey all, I'm thinking of getting HQI for the new 125, and I have been reading that they last longer than ordinary MH bulbs. I'm going with the 10000K's or higher. Any links or hard facts would be much appreciated.

Thanks!

[Ironreef]

I would like to know where the link is also. I just hea they MAY last longer. The only test i know of on the web is from Sanjay and its 400w =no double end either.

[golfish]

I too have read that double ended bulbs last longer then mogul base bulbs (except Iwasaki).....PaulErik posted some good info on this same thread at RC.

[Ironreef]

Many ppl have read but there is no written proff. if so inform me. i don't doubt they do but I would like to see if it was written and proven. if so it should be easy to prove. otherwise ppl will say 12k is the best cuz he said so but then we find not so. Just an example we know its not true. Most hours are by the manufacture. but intensity of the hours is diff. i belive in Dec. info is coming out on new hqi par but not old bulbs

[golfish]

Michael, did you read the post by PaulErik? He had to be getting his numbers somewhere. Ask him............One things for sure, The double ended bulbs are a little cheaper.

[Ironreef]

Weren't those ## by the manufature and for NEW bulbs and estimated life? I would like to see one test old bulbs like sanjay . Independant person. Manufacture IMO doesn't mean much if they haven't actual tested an old bulb. I haven't seen that. just estimated ## Unless it was there and I missed it. But testing by manufacture is like testing a SUV some say they are safe some say they will roll. Like Montaro. (sp) I'm not debating that they won't last longer just where do ppl get the info. i just want to read it. But if I were going to use 10k-20k only I would get hqi then I wouldn't worry about bulbs and use whatever.

[PerryinCA]

Well, not written proof, but I have spoken (via e-mail) to Sanjay about this in the past, and he said you could expect the double-ended HQI lamps to last as long as the Iwasaki 400w he uses. He also said that he leaves his EYE 400w on for two years before he see's that they need replacment.

Is that the end all answer? Of course not, there never is, but IMO the single ended 10k loose intensity fast than the double ended. Thats just been my experience.

-Perry

[Aquariust]

Definately check this thread:

http://www.reefcentral.com/vbulletin...threadid=44261

There's alot of info at animal network.

http://www.animalnetwork.com/fish2/aqfm/default.asp

Here's an intresting article as well.

http://www.personal.psu.edu/faculty/...omparison.html

I'm still in debate on wether to go w/ 3 250W 10000K HQI DE or Mogul. According to the articles I have read the bulbs should be repleced every year for mogul, and a year and a half with DE HQI. And manufactures specs are 5000hrs for mogul, and 6000hrs for DE HQI. Of course most bulbs lose about 37% (some more) of their intensity w/ in a year. The 10000K is probaly the best bulb on the market, lasts long and holds it's intensity. The sunburst is just to iffy, poor intensity. The Radiums are tooo blue and lose intensity very quickly. Now some like their Iwasaki's but I just think they're to yellow, and need heavy atinic support to be even comparable to 10000K or higher. But, they hold their intensity very long, work on cheap ballasts, cheap as heck, and have a long lamp life.

I just have to decide if spending alittle extra money in the beginning for the HQI will pay off in the long run as opposed to running standard ballasts w/ Mogul MH's. Bulbs are aliitle cheaper, they last longer, and the ballasts use less electricity. So I'd assume they may pay off.

Well here's my current list:

3 250W Ballasts $150
3 Reflectors $75
3 250W Sunburst or Ushio $270
6 13W PC Atinic Bulbs $36

Price: $535

Total WPG: 6

OR:

3 250W HQI Ballast PFO/LampsNow $390 - Icecap $510 – Hamilton $360
3 Reflectors $75
3 10000K 250W HQI $ 255
6 13W PC Atinic Bulbs $36

Price: $ 756 – $ 876 - $ 726

Total WPG: 6

OR:

3 400W Ballasts $180
3 Reflectors $75
3 400W Sunburst or Ushio $290
6 13W PC Atinic Bulbs $36

Price: $581

Total WPG: 9.6

[golfish]

The lighting thing has to be the hardest to decide. PLEASE don't go with the Sunburst. You will not be happy. If you plan to run some VHO's I suggest the 250 watt Iwaskis. From your options above it looks like you ruled out the double ended HQI bulbs......

Mark

[scubadude]

3 250W 10000K HQI DE or Mogul

I say 3 of these DE of course You can probably save yourself even more $$ if you did a DIY retro, which has easily become available nowadays Not only have i heard that the HQI DE bulbs will last longer but hear that they use less electricity....The longterm investment is well above quota IMO a few querks to iron out but no biggy. You gotta remember though that HQI has not alot of research done behind it like Iwasakis do.

[Ltspd]

Something else you need to consider is heat. (3) 400w Iwasaki's will get HOT! What will be the cost of a chiller?

From my recent experience with HQI's and Iwasaki's I like the HQI's better. They dont seem to produce as much heat, sounds strange but I am running no fans where I use to have to with the 250w 6500k's.

I still think that even the HQI 10kk's need some actinic supplment to make them look even better. Probaly not as much as the Iwasaki's but still some is needed IMO.

Here is a suggestion that seems to have worked for me. I purchased the LN elec ballast (250w) to run my bulbs. The reason being is that ballast will power HQI's, Iwasaki's, and most mogual socket bulbs. This allows you to change bulb types easier without the added cost of a new ballast. I went from Iwasaki's to HQIs by only changing the holder and bulbs.

[Aquariust]

Thanks Guys! Let me clarify myself.

The first set of lights is 250 Mogul. The second set is 250W HQI DE. The third is 400W Mogul's.

I've read if you want 250W of sunburst, get the 400's That was the only reason I considered 400W's.

The 250W Moguls are second choice to me as of know. I'm thinking of going w/ the HQI DE 10000K's. I really love the look, even w/o atinics. Although, there will be 6 13W Blue PC's. So that will help alittle.

Yes the 250W Mogul will be less expensive to set up initailly, but the HQI sounds like the better bet for the long run.

Now I just have to decide on the ballasts.

Thanks for all the help!

[golfish]

The first set of lights is 250 Mogul. The second set is 250W HQI DE. The third is 400W Mogul's.

3 250W HQI Ballast PFO/LampsNow $390 - Icecap $510 – Hamilton $360 3 Reflectors $75
3 10000K 250W HQI $ 255
6 13W PC Atinic Bulbs $36

This is where I'm confused. Where do you plan to mount the double ended bulbs

[Ironreef]

Originally posted by PerryinCA


Is that the end all answer? Of course not, there never is, but IMO the single ended 10k loose intensity fast than the double ended. Thats just been my experience.

-Perry

Like I said I don't doubt hqi last longer but there still is no written proof that I know of. Sanjay tested old bulbs before and I bet no one would have even concidered Iwaski to have more blue than any 10k after a few mo. I'm not comparing Iwaski to hqi Just saying when ppl guess you never now without test. Who thought combisan was water 99%. The post say hqi do they last longer? wheres the proof? All I'm saying there is none. If there is show me

[PerryinCA]

There isn't any Just speculation. Personally I would go for the Iwasaki's over the HQI. I've used them all and wasn't too impressed with the HQI. Then again, my next tank will have 1k watt 10ks.

The numbers on the tests show that the HQI is way up there in PAR and yadadad.... real world experience has shown me that you simply can't get the growth and coloration from the HQI that you can from the higher wattage Iwasaki (provided there is enough actinic to offset). DE HQI are the cream of the crop in the 250w, but still can't compare to the EYE across the board, except for maybe the energy savings, which isn't much to begin with. Total savings for 2 250w setup is in the ballpark of 1.5-2KWH per day savings over a 2x 400w. Thats about 15-25 cents a day for me....

-Perry

[newreefman1]

I disagree with the above completely. I find my HQI's intensity to be amazing and attribute most of my success with my anemone to the intense lighting. I have used the 150 watt 12k and 10k bulbs and both are quite intense. I keep acro, mushrooms, and my anemone all with great success and if given the choice and no budget contraints would go HQI hands now 10 times out of 10.

J

[golfish]

I agree with Perry. The 250 watt HQI's are very close to the 250 watt Iwasaki but don't compare to the 400 watter. I would compare the light that BOTH my 250 watt DE HQI's put out to the sinlge 400 watt Iwasaki....except for color

The problem with the 400 watter is the heat. The heat coming form the 400 is probably twice that coming from one of the HQI's.

[Ironreef]

IMO I would use Iwaski over any 10k if using actinics. But since Alantis lighting test he is using 400w 6.5 and 400w ushio? on an hqi ballast. =they are having the same growth so far. But I like the Iwaski but I like the ushio also. Just I'm cheap. theres others who swear by Iwaski or by hqi each way. the best is to decide which bulb. If you are going 10-20k only get the hqi

[Ltspd]

IMO, FWIW.

I ran the 250w Iwasaki's for about 6-8 months and have just recently switched over to the 10kk HQI's. As far as just the bulbs compared without actinic's the 10kk's take it hands down. But, IMO you still need some actinic with the 10kk's, or atleast I feel that the color is even better.

I am able to run (3) HQI bulbs and (2) NO actinic bulbs for what it cost me to run (2) Iwasaki's and (2) 96w pc actinic's. So I am able to provide better light for the same cost.

But, in the 400w, nothing comes close to the Iwasaki's with VHO actinic's

[golfish]

Hey Paul, did you get the NO bulbs to work? what was the problem?