400w - Ushio or Hamilton

Reef Engineer · 01-20-2002, 08:44 PM

I did a search on several boards and saw some other info on bulb types but decided to simply ask the question to those that have seen both the 10K Ushios and the 10 Hamilton bulbs in action - which do you prefer? I really don't care to hear anything about the 175w or the 250w bulbs since it's comparing apples and oranges. I am currently using 4-400w Iwasakis and they're just a tad too yellow for my liking. I have used upwards of 6-160w VHOs and the color rendition is still not to my liking.

When I used 250w Iwasakis, the color wasn't that big a deal but these are pretty yellow. (and yes, these are the correct, made for the reef tank, Iwasaki bulbs which are "whiter" than the other Iwasakis made)

Anyway. I plan to get the bulbs fairly soon so, Ushio or Hamilton, which do you prefer?

Randy

P.S. For those of you that like the osrams or the radium or the sunburst, I'm happy for you but not really interested in how great you think they are.

It's going to be 10K for me,

**Ninong** · 01-20-2002, 09:15 PM

Randy, how's this for a novel idea: Why not compare two different 400w 10,000K metal halide lamps, like the AB-10000 vs. the Ushio?

Sanjay Joshi has tested both of those on the same Magnetek ballast. He tested the 400w AB-10000 back in Nov. 1998 and he tested the 400w Ushio 10,000K in May 2001. The AB-10000 measured 135 PPFD vs. 99 PPFD for the Ushio. http://www.personal.psu.edu/faculty/.../aquarium.html

BTW, it has always been my understanding that Hamilton gets their 10,000K metal halide lamps from Bayerische Lampe und Vacuum (BLV), which is a wholly owned subsidiary of Ushio of Tokyo, Japan. BLV brands the exact same 10,000K lamps as: Ushio, BLV, Red Sea, Hamilton, and I believe one other brand. I doubt that you would notice any difference between the Ushio and the Hamilton other than the name.

Ninong

Reef Engineer · 01-20-2002, 09:19 PM

Ninong,

That's exactly what I wanted to hear. I was curious as to why the Hamiltons were more expensive than the Ushios.

Thanks for the feedback,

Randy

**Ninong** · 01-20-2002, 09:26 PM

Randy,

There are also some slight differences in the spectral distribution charts between the AB-10000 and the Ushio 10,000K. You can compare them on Sanjay's site, also AB has a spectral distribution chart on their site: www.ab-aqualine.de

According to AB-Aqualine, their AB-10000 lamps are really 13,000 Kelvin. Here's a quote from their site:

"The color temerature of the bulbs has been increased by 3,000 Kelvin to an effective 13,000 Kelvin increasing the cold white component."

Could be more marketing hype, you never know.

But people that I know who have used both say that the AB lamps seem just a little bit more bluish-white than the Ushio lamps.

Ninong

Ironreef · 01-20-2002, 09:27 PM

whichever you choose post feedback in a few mo on your sps. FWIW most any german bulb = the both you mentioned many ppl are happy with. Theres the other 10k which few hate

**Ninong** · 01-20-2002, 09:35 PM

Ironreef is probably thinking of the Chinese imports. The feedback on them has not been very promising to say the least. That would include the likes of the Blueline 10,000K and the ALS 12,000K Sunburst.

Ninong

Ironreef · 01-21-2002, 02:22 AM

yup wasn't sure tehy all cam from china?? But just like all things germans,USA ,Japan and a few other countries usually put out quality in there products. Some better than others. But then there the other countries that may thinks cheaper with a cheaper price but but get a poor product IMO where the 50k

Iwaski

Nanook01 · 01-21-2002, 05:09 AM

I'm using the ushio 400w 10000K on the HQI ballast by PFO...the color is ICE white and very intense. I think the intensity rivals the new 400w Iwasaki, even though it has much less PAR. I am using the Iwasaki 400w on my 58g prop tank and find it to be very yellow. For my display tank, I really like the bright white look of the ushio. No comparison for the Hamilton vs Ushio for you, sorry.

Nanook

Reef Engineer · 01-21-2002, 03:38 PM

Thanks, folks! I was looking at replacing these Iwasakis as well because I kept seeing how some of my corals looked under 10K lighting and really liked the color rendition so much better. I was leaning towards the Ushios but then noticed that the Hamiltons seem to be a little more expensive and, in this supply & demand world we live in, I figured that something had to be amiss!

Thanks for the info,

Randy

*Papa Doug* · 01-21-2002, 07:25 PM

Hey Randy; I use 400 watt Sunbursts

But I wont tell ya how good they are.

Now dont get mad at me for joking or I will not let your beautiful tank grace my desktop anymore.

naser · 01-21-2002, 07:36 PM

the 400 watt sunburst arent good at all. real dim, bulbs break, but hey they have good customer service i guess? randy i was looking at the same thing you are.. im replacing my iwasaki's too and want to go to a 10k of sorts... i have a 10 ushio they i can run by and you can fire it up.. its getting old though.

**Ninong** · 01-21-2002, 07:40 PM

Randy,

Don't you have something like five 400w metal halides over your tank? Plus a ton of VHO actinics, if I remember correctly. Why not try a combination of 400w 20,000K Radiums and 400w 10,000K either AB or Ushio? Plus all your VHO actinics, too! That's what I would love to see over your gorgeous tank!

Ninong

newreefman1 · 01-21-2002, 10:35 PM

My preference is those 150 watt HQI bulbs. Boy are they bright. Why dont you add about 20 of em up there ????????

Randy, your tank looks great no matter what light....Use some shoplights and a Halogen kit from Home depot.

Ive actually seen both lit and I prefer the Ushio bulbs. Got no data to back it up, just visual

J

Reef Engineer · 01-22-2002, 02:33 AM

LOL! You guys crack me up!

I thought about mixing bulbs and have given though to the 20K, 12K, 10K as well as my current Iwasakis but decided that I didn't want to complicate my life any more than I need to. I currently use 4-400w Iwasakis and have 4-160w VHO actinics to go along with them. I used to have 6-160w VHOs BUT I accidently dropped one of the ballasts in SW and it fried the thing. Down to 4 of those guys now.

Anyway, I can see a shift since the tank is becoming visibly more yellow. I've taken water out of the tank and placed it in a white bucket just to make sure that it wasn't the water itself that was yellowing.

At this point, it looks like I'll probably be going with the 10K Ushios unless that ebay idiot comes back from the dead and sends me those 8 Hamiltons I orderd.

I won't hold my breath.

Thanks again!

Randy

naser · 01-22-2002, 02:48 AM

that new marine fish and reef magazine did a test on both blueline and ushio's 10k and the sunburst 12k..... i will put it in ppfd (photosynthetic photo flux density) basically spectral output..

als sunburst 66.84
blueline 71.60
osram 90.06
these are all without reflectors also.

naser · 01-22-2002, 03:34 AM

oh and reeffanatic.com has the 10k ushio's for 105.... makes me wonder now why the hamilton's are 119?

*Papa Doug* · 01-22-2002, 02:28 PM

Naser, those reading would correspond what my eyes see.

Although my supplementals are only 175 watt, run on an Icecap ballast. I would say there is a small difference in the Ushio & Hamilton. The Hamilton seems a little brighter, or a crisper white perhaps. Not enough to worry about the diff though.

When my centered 400 watt Sunburst wears out, { if that ever happens,

}, I am switching to Ushio 400 watt.

01-20-2002, 08:44 PM	#1
Reef Engineer Council Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: San Diego, CA USA Posts: 274	400w - Ushio or Hamilton I did a search on several boards and saw some other info on bulb types but decided to simply ask the question to those that have seen both the 10K Ushios and the 10 Hamilton bulbs in action - which do you prefer? I really don't care to hear anything about the 175w or the 250w bulbs since it's comparing apples and oranges. I am currently using 4-400w Iwasakis and they're just a tad too yellow for my liking. I have used upwards of 6-160w VHOs and the color rendition is still not to my liking. When I used 250w Iwasakis, the color wasn't that big a deal but these are pretty yellow. (and yes, these are the correct, made for the reef tank, Iwasaki bulbs which are "whiter" than the other Iwasakis made) Anyway. I plan to get the bulbs fairly soon so, Ushio or Hamilton, which do you prefer? Randy P.S. For those of you that like the osrams or the radium or the sunburst, I'm happy for you but not really interested in how great you think they are. It's going to be 10K for me, __________________ Come meet the gang! http://www.homestead.com/reefengineer/homepage.html

01-20-2002, 09:19 PM	#3
Reef Engineer Council Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: San Diego, CA USA Posts: 274	Ninong, That's exactly what I wanted to hear. I was curious as to why the Hamiltons were more expensive than the Ushios. Thanks for the feedback, Randy __________________ Come meet the gang! http://www.homestead.com/reefengineer/homepage.html

01-21-2002, 05:09 AM	#8
Nanook01 Tenant Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: st. louis, MO Posts: 89	I'm using the ushio 400w 10000K on the HQI ballast by PFO...the color is ICE white and very intense. I think the intensity rivals the new 400w Iwasaki, even though it has much less PAR. I am using the Iwasaki 400w on my 58g prop tank and find it to be very yellow. For my display tank, I really like the bright white look of the ushio. No comparison for the Hamilton vs Ushio for you, sorry. Nanook __________________ The wind blew, the **** flew and then they came two by two.

01-21-2002, 03:38 PM	#9
Reef Engineer Council Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: San Diego, CA USA Posts: 274	Thanks, folks! I was looking at replacing these Iwasakis as well because I kept seeing how some of my corals looked under 10K lighting and really liked the color rendition so much better. I was leaning towards the Ushios but then noticed that the Hamiltons seem to be a little more expensive and, in this supply & demand world we live in, I figured that something had to be amiss! Thanks for the info, Randy __________________ Come meet the gang! http://www.homestead.com/reefengineer/homepage.html

01-21-2002, 07:25 PM	#10
Papa Doug Gallery Team Join Date: Mar 2000 Location: Manitoba, Canada Posts: 844	Hey Randy; I use 400 watt Sunbursts But I wont tell ya how good they are. Now dont get mad at me for joking or I will not let your beautiful tank grace my desktop anymore. __________________ Doug

01-20-2002, 09:15 PM	#2
Ninong Moderator Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Louisiana Posts: 20,691	Randy, how's this for a novel idea: Why not compare two different 400w 10,000K metal halide lamps, like the AB-10000 vs. the Ushio? Sanjay Joshi has tested both of those on the same Magnetek ballast. He tested the 400w AB-10000 back in Nov. 1998 and he tested the 400w Ushio 10,000K in May 2001. The AB-10000 measured 135 PPFD vs. 99 PPFD for the Ushio. http://www.personal.psu.edu/faculty/.../aquarium.html BTW, it has always been my understanding that Hamilton gets their 10,000K metal halide lamps from Bayerische Lampe und Vacuum (BLV), which is a wholly owned subsidiary of Ushio of Tokyo, Japan. BLV brands the exact same 10,000K lamps as: Ushio, BLV, Red Sea, Hamilton, and I believe one other brand. I doubt that you would notice any difference between the Ushio and the Hamilton other than the name. Ninong

01-20-2002, 09:26 PM	#4
Ninong Moderator Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Louisiana Posts: 20,691	Randy, There are also some slight differences in the spectral distribution charts between the AB-10000 and the Ushio 10,000K. You can compare them on Sanjay's site, also AB has a spectral distribution chart on their site: www.ab-aqualine.de According to AB-Aqualine, their AB-10000 lamps are really 13,000 Kelvin. Here's a quote from their site: "The color temerature of the bulbs has been increased by 3,000 Kelvin to an effective 13,000 Kelvin increasing the cold white component." Could be more marketing hype, you never know. But people that I know who have used both say that the AB lamps seem just a little bit more bluish-white than the Ushio lamps. Ninong

01-20-2002, 09:27 PM	#5
Ironreef Governor Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Pacific WA Posts: 1,220	whichever you choose post feedback in a few mo on your sps. FWIW most any german bulb = the both you mentioned many ppl are happy with. Theres the other 10k which few hate

01-20-2002, 09:35 PM	#6
Ninong Moderator Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Louisiana Posts: 20,691	Ironreef is probably thinking of the Chinese imports. The feedback on them has not been very promising to say the least. That would include the likes of the Blueline 10,000K and the ALS 12,000K Sunburst. Ninong

01-21-2002, 02:22 AM	#7
Ironreef Governor Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Pacific WA Posts: 1,220	yup wasn't sure tehy all cam from china?? But just like all things germans,USA ,Japan and a few other countries usually put out quality in there products. Some better than others. But then there the other countries that may thinks cheaper with a cheaper price but but get a poor product IMO where the 50k Iwaski

01-21-2002, 07:36 PM	#11
naser super-reefer Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: SAN DIEGO, CA Posts: 1,908	the 400 watt sunburst arent good at all. real dim, bulbs break, but hey they have good customer service i guess? randy i was looking at the same thing you are.. im replacing my iwasaki's too and want to go to a 10k of sorts... i have a 10 ushio they i can run by and you can fire it up.. its getting old though.

01-21-2002, 07:40 PM	#12
Ninong Moderator Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Louisiana Posts: 20,691	Randy, Don't you have something like five 400w metal halides over your tank? Plus a ton of VHO actinics, if I remember correctly. Why not try a combination of 400w 20,000K Radiums and 400w 10,000K either AB or Ushio? Plus all your VHO actinics, too! That's what I would love to see over your gorgeous tank! Ninong

01-21-2002, 10:35 PM	#13
newreefman1 Council Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: SanDiego Posts: 310	My preference is those 150 watt HQI bulbs. Boy are they bright. Why dont you add about 20 of em up there ???????? Randy, your tank looks great no matter what light....Use some shoplights and a Halogen kit from Home depot. Ive actually seen both lit and I prefer the Ushio bulbs. Got no data to back it up, just visual J __________________ http://members.home.net/jasonco6/fulltank

01-22-2002, 02:33 AM	#14
Reef Engineer Council Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: San Diego, CA USA Posts: 274	LOL! You guys crack me up! I thought about mixing bulbs and have given though to the 20K, 12K, 10K as well as my current Iwasakis but decided that I didn't want to complicate my life any more than I need to. I currently use 4-400w Iwasakis and have 4-160w VHO actinics to go along with them. I used to have 6-160w VHOs BUT I accidently dropped one of the ballasts in SW and it fried the thing. Down to 4 of those guys now. Anyway, I can see a shift since the tank is becoming visibly more yellow. I've taken water out of the tank and placed it in a white bucket just to make sure that it wasn't the water itself that was yellowing. At this point, it looks like I'll probably be going with the 10K Ushios unless that ebay idiot comes back from the dead and sends me those 8 Hamiltons I orderd. I won't hold my breath. Thanks again! Randy __________________ Come meet the gang! http://www.homestead.com/reefengineer/homepage.html

01-22-2002, 02:48 AM	#15
naser super-reefer Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: SAN DIEGO, CA Posts: 1,908	that new marine fish and reef magazine did a test on both blueline and ushio's 10k and the sunburst 12k..... i will put it in ppfd (photosynthetic photo flux density) basically spectral output.. als sunburst 66.84 blueline 71.60 osram 90.06 these are all without reflectors also.

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)

01-22-2002, 03:34 AM	#16
naser super-reefer Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: SAN DIEGO, CA Posts: 1,908	oh and reeffanatic.com has the 10k ushio's for 105.... makes me wonder now why the hamilton's are 119?

01-22-2002, 02:28 PM	#17
Papa Doug Gallery Team Join Date: Mar 2000 Location: Manitoba, Canada Posts: 844	Naser, those reading would correspond what my eyes see. Although my supplementals are only 175 watt, run on an Icecap ballast. I would say there is a small difference in the Ushio & Hamilton. The Hamilton seems a little brighter, or a crisper white perhaps. Not enough to worry about the diff though. When my centered 400 watt Sunburst wears out, { if that ever happens, }, I am switching to Ushio 400 watt. __________________ Doug

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