HQI PFO ballast with 10,000k bulb

Dive_Master · 01-30-2002, 07:28 PM

Can I use the HQI ballast with 10,000k German made bulb?

If so, does it affect bulbs life span?

I want to experiment with 20,000k bulb and I heard that you need PFO HQI ballast to run 20,000k German made bulbs.

Ironreef · 01-30-2002, 10:30 PM

What watts? Yes you can run 10-20k with hqi. they run them better. There isn't a test done on lifespan that I know of. You can also run 10-20k on regular ballast but 10=10% less and 20k =20% less par per Sanjays test on 400watters.

**Ninong** · 01-31-2002, 09:53 AM

If anything, the HQI ballast may give them a longer lifespan. Are you talking about 250w or 400w? And what brand? The AB-10000 lamps seem to run better on HQI ballasts than on regular ballasts.

Ninong

Dive_Master · 01-31-2002, 11:28 AM

Thanks for the feedback.

Originally, I wanted to use 10,000k AB screw in bulb on HQI ballast because I want to experiment with 20,000 K screw in bulb in the future. All of these are 250 W.

I was told that 20,000k will not run on standard ballast and that I need HQI ballast. Is this true?

Now, looking at my tank, (24" deep, 84" long), I whink I would be better of with 400W screw in AB bulb 10,000K or 20,000K.

Should I go with 3 bulbs 400 W or should I stay with 3 bulbs 250W either solution with the HQI or standard ballast.

I do not want to go with the double-ended lights becuse of the UV problem.

I am planning to have SPS corals!

Thanks in Advanced!

**Ninong** · 01-31-2002, 12:24 PM

I have read the same thing, that the 20,000K lamps (both 250w and 400w) require HQI ballasts. However, as Ironreef pointed out in his reply, Sanjay Joshi did test the 400w 20,000K Radiums on a regular Magnetek ballast. I would suggest that it would be wise to use only an HQI ballast if you are considering 20,000K. Also, one of the online vendors claims that the AB-10000 lamps sometimes have problems with regular ballasts and run better on HQI ballasts.

In choosing your lighting for your tank, the first thing you have to decide is how much money you want to spend (both initially and forever after on electricity) and how much heat you want to deal with. That may give you a different perspective on whether you want to consider 400w sizes or not.

The minimum that I would recommend for that size tank would be 3*250w 10,000K metal halide lamps. If you ever wanted to switch to 3*250w 20,000K metal halides you would get less PAR. You didn't say if you plan on using any other supplemental lighting? If you are using supplemental lighting in addition to the metal halides, then I think you will be fine with either the 10,000K or the 20,000K in the 250 watt size. You would use actinics to supplement the 10,000K. If you go with 20,000K, you would probably want a combination of actinics and wide spectrum lamps for supplementation.

If you have not ruled out the 400 watt size based on cost or heat factors, then 3*400w lamps would give even more intensity (PAR).

Ninong

Ironreef · 01-31-2002, 10:25 PM

I don't see how a bulb running in a hqi ballast would make them last longer. there are alot of 10k bulbs not made for hqi but do run better with hqi= more input current. 20k is made to be used under hqi. Some 10k are made to run under hqi but NOT all. There is a difference have read that but to much detal for me to explain right. But Just like mv and mh. mv maynit las as long under mh. But nothing has been proven one way or another

**Ninong** · 01-31-2002, 11:18 PM

Iron,

One of the major online vendors claims that the reason they no longer carry AB-10000 mogul base lamps is because they do not fire properly or last very long on regular ballasts and that this claim is based on their handling of customer complaints. They know that many of their customers do not have HQI ballasts and that they are ordering these lamps online without talking to anyone about possible ballast problems. This particular vendor claims that the AB-10000 mogul base lamps run fine on HQI ballasts but have problems on regular ballasts.

This information has been repeated by a couple of hobbyists in posts on other bulletin boards. I have no way of knowing how accurate it is but since Dive_Master is considering both 10,000K and 20,000K I think it would be wise to choose an HQI ballast... and if the information that is being put out by that online vendor is correct, the lamps will last longer on HQI ballasts than they would on regular ballasts. Again, they are talking about AB lamps only, not Ushio/BLV lamps. If you would like to know the name of the online vendor, shoot me an e-mail.

Ninong

bowfront · 02-01-2002, 12:02 PM

I think that the proper bulb/ballast combiination for MH/MV/HQI lighting is a not only confusing but poorly understood by most. The more I poke around this issue the more I learn. Recently I wrote to a true "lighting guru" concerning MH/MV bulbs currently available in the aquarium market, specically in the 250w range. This was part of his response, which I think should be shared with others.

"The 250 Watt Iwasaki 6500K bulb is a conversion bulb.
It’s recommended for a mercury vapor HX (high
reactance autotransformer) ballast. Magnetic metal
halide ballasts usually over ride the Iwasaki a
little. Some ballasts are combination ballasts MH/MV.
These ballasts normally over power MV bulbs because
they are designed for MH lamps. I usually recommend
the mercury vapor HX ballast. This ballast has a
lower starting voltage and the Iwasaki is designed for
this. This ballast should give the best performance.

I personally have not found one ballast that will
operate all bulbs properly (its not possible). Each
bulb is a little different (some are very different).

The most common lamp types are:
European pulse ignition
Standard pulse ignition
North American probe start
Conversion (Iwasaki) / Mercury Vapor probe start

Each type requires a different operating voltage
(burning voltage), operating amps (burning amps), and
starting voltage / starting type. Here is an example:
If the ballast is designed for probe start lamps and
you use a European pulse ignition lamp most likely the
light output will be poor and the starting difference
can cause excessive stress on the electrodes.

I usually recommend that people match the lamp with
the ballast the lamp was designed for. Sometimes this
isn’t easy if someone doesn’t really know what the
differences are."

Honestly the best thing to do IMO is go directly to the manufacturer of the bulb that you are going to use and ask for a list of ballasts that will correctly operate that bulb. As stated above the bulb has been developed for use with a particular ballast type and may or maynot operate correctly if used with the wrong ballast. Just my 2 cents.

01-30-2002, 07:28 PM	#1
Dive_Master Citizen Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 214	HQI PFO ballast with 10,000k bulb Can I use the HQI ballast with 10,000k German made bulb? If so, does it affect bulbs life span? I want to experiment with 20,000k bulb and I heard that you need PFO HQI ballast to run 20,000k German made bulbs.

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01-30-2002, 10:30 PM	#2
Ironreef Governor Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Pacific WA Posts: 1,220	What watts? Yes you can run 10-20k with hqi. they run them better. There isn't a test done on lifespan that I know of. You can also run 10-20k on regular ballast but 10=10% less and 20k =20% less par per Sanjays test on 400watters.

01-31-2002, 09:53 AM	#3
Ninong Moderator Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Louisiana Posts: 20,691	If anything, the HQI ballast may give them a longer lifespan. Are you talking about 250w or 400w? And what brand? The AB-10000 lamps seem to run better on HQI ballasts than on regular ballasts. Ninong

01-31-2002, 11:28 AM	#4
Dive_Master Citizen Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 214	Thanks for the feedback. Originally, I wanted to use 10,000k AB screw in bulb on HQI ballast because I want to experiment with 20,000 K screw in bulb in the future. All of these are 250 W. I was told that 20,000k will not run on standard ballast and that I need HQI ballast. Is this true? Now, looking at my tank, (24" deep, 84" long), I whink I would be better of with 400W screw in AB bulb 10,000K or 20,000K. Should I go with 3 bulbs 400 W or should I stay with 3 bulbs 250W either solution with the HQI or standard ballast. I do not want to go with the double-ended lights becuse of the UV problem. I am planning to have SPS corals! Thanks in Advanced!

01-31-2002, 12:24 PM	#5
Ninong Moderator Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Louisiana Posts: 20,691	I have read the same thing, that the 20,000K lamps (both 250w and 400w) require HQI ballasts. However, as Ironreef pointed out in his reply, Sanjay Joshi did test the 400w 20,000K Radiums on a regular Magnetek ballast. I would suggest that it would be wise to use only an HQI ballast if you are considering 20,000K. Also, one of the online vendors claims that the AB-10000 lamps sometimes have problems with regular ballasts and run better on HQI ballasts. In choosing your lighting for your tank, the first thing you have to decide is how much money you want to spend (both initially and forever after on electricity) and how much heat you want to deal with. That may give you a different perspective on whether you want to consider 400w sizes or not. The minimum that I would recommend for that size tank would be 3250w 10,000K metal halide lamps. If you ever wanted to switch to 3250w 20,000K metal halides you would get less PAR. You didn't say if you plan on using any other supplemental lighting? If you are using supplemental lighting in addition to the metal halides, then I think you will be fine with either the 10,000K or the 20,000K in the 250 watt size. You would use actinics to supplement the 10,000K. If you go with 20,000K, you would probably want a combination of actinics and wide spectrum lamps for supplementation. If you have not ruled out the 400 watt size based on cost or heat factors, then 3*400w lamps would give even more intensity (PAR). Ninong

01-31-2002, 10:25 PM	#6
Ironreef Governor Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Pacific WA Posts: 1,220	I don't see how a bulb running in a hqi ballast would make them last longer. there are alot of 10k bulbs not made for hqi but do run better with hqi= more input current. 20k is made to be used under hqi. Some 10k are made to run under hqi but NOT all. There is a difference have read that but to much detal for me to explain right. But Just like mv and mh. mv maynit las as long under mh. But nothing has been proven one way or another

01-31-2002, 11:18 PM	#7
Ninong Moderator Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Louisiana Posts: 20,691	Iron, One of the major online vendors claims that the reason they no longer carry AB-10000 mogul base lamps is because they do not fire properly or last very long on regular ballasts and that this claim is based on their handling of customer complaints. They know that many of their customers do not have HQI ballasts and that they are ordering these lamps online without talking to anyone about possible ballast problems. This particular vendor claims that the AB-10000 mogul base lamps run fine on HQI ballasts but have problems on regular ballasts. This information has been repeated by a couple of hobbyists in posts on other bulletin boards. I have no way of knowing how accurate it is but since Dive_Master is considering both 10,000K and 20,000K I think it would be wise to choose an HQI ballast... and if the information that is being put out by that online vendor is correct, the lamps will last longer on HQI ballasts than they would on regular ballasts. Again, they are talking about AB lamps only, not Ushio/BLV lamps. If you would like to know the name of the online vendor, shoot me an e-mail. Ninong

02-01-2002, 12:02 PM	#8
bowfront Just Moved In Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Palm Beach Gardens, FL Posts: 48	I think that the proper bulb/ballast combiination for MH/MV/HQI lighting is a not only confusing but poorly understood by most. The more I poke around this issue the more I learn. Recently I wrote to a true "lighting guru" concerning MH/MV bulbs currently available in the aquarium market, specically in the 250w range. This was part of his response, which I think should be shared with others. "The 250 Watt Iwasaki 6500K bulb is a conversion bulb. It’s recommended for a mercury vapor HX (high reactance autotransformer) ballast. Magnetic metal halide ballasts usually over ride the Iwasaki a little. Some ballasts are combination ballasts MH/MV. These ballasts normally over power MV bulbs because they are designed for MH lamps. I usually recommend the mercury vapor HX ballast. This ballast has a lower starting voltage and the Iwasaki is designed for this. This ballast should give the best performance. I personally have not found one ballast that will operate all bulbs properly (its not possible). Each bulb is a little different (some are very different). The most common lamp types are: European pulse ignition Standard pulse ignition North American probe start Conversion (Iwasaki) / Mercury Vapor probe start Each type requires a different operating voltage (burning voltage), operating amps (burning amps), and starting voltage / starting type. Here is an example: If the ballast is designed for probe start lamps and you use a European pulse ignition lamp most likely the light output will be poor and the starting difference can cause excessive stress on the electrodes. I usually recommend that people match the lamp with the ballast the lamp was designed for. Sometimes this isn’t easy if someone doesn’t really know what the differences are." Honestly the best thing to do IMO is go directly to the manufacturer of the bulb that you are going to use and ask for a list of ballasts that will correctly operate that bulb. As stated above the bulb has been developed for use with a particular ballast type and may or maynot operate correctly if used with the wrong ballast. Just my 2 cents.

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