AHHH lion fish help again

[fergo]

Ok,

Its happening again. My lion fish this morning has small white spots on his fins and body. he is not moving much, not eating. his eyes seems he same and are ok.

Now the LFS said that Lion fish cannot get Ich? and suggested that last time was velvet?

what should i do, and what do we think could be wrong? how do i stop this from happening? I have been maintaining the tank well, regular water changes, feeding a varied died, temp and salinty stable, Amonia, nitrate and nitrite are all good, meaning ammonia 0, nitrite 0, nitrate 0.

[leebca]

Carefully make a diagnosis. Lionfish can get Marine Ich (Cryptocaryon irritans). If it's Marine Ich, move the fish to a hospital tank and treat it by hyposalinity.

Over 48 hours lower the specific gravity to 1.008 to 1.010. Use a refractometer to be absolutely accurate. Watch water parameters, especially pH, very closely. Do water changes to keep ammonia and nitrites very low. Stabilize the water and wait it out.

A fish that contracts Marine Velvet (Amyloodinium ocellatum) usually dies pretty quickly. I've not known any fish in captivity to survive a true Marine Velvet infestation.

Ask if you have questions.

[fergo]

ok thanks for the info.

How do i tell the differnce between the two? ich or velvet? they both sound similar. however, the lion is not breathing heavy

[leebca]

By the time you see the fine powder dusting of a fish that has Marine Velvet, the fish is near death.

However, the white spots of Marine Ich are more the size of table salt or table sugar.

Here's two photos in this post:
http://www.petsforum.com/personal/tr...marineich.html

[fergo]

its hard to tell which one he might have? both a very similar.

[leebca]

When you have experience, it is very easy to tell them apart. As I wrote, if you see the very small white spots of Marine Velvet, the fish is likely to die in a day or two. The aquarist won't see this condition until near the end of the fish's life. Those spots are very tiny, like powdered sugar on a donut. The 'sheen' given is what gave the parasite infection its name of 'velvet.'

Marine Ich is distinct, larger white spots the size of a grain of table salt. No sheen. Most of these spots can be individually seen, whereas in a Velvet infection the individual spots can't easily be seen at all.

[fergo]

Ahhh ha... ok he had ich. and i got some great stuff and it cleared up. i will keep him in quarantine for a bit and make sure.

[fergo]

The stuff i got was Vertonex? any idea how long i should keep him in the quarantine tank for?

[leebca]

I was concerned by your June 9 reply that you found a 'miracle cure' product. According to the literature on Vertonex:

To assist in the treatment of whitespot (cryptocaryon irritans) when corals and invertebrates are present in marine aquarium fish. Vertonex can be used safely with invertebrates and corals present in the aquarium.
* Use 3mL per 70 Litres of aquarium water daily for 4 days. A major water change is recommended approximately 14 days after the treatment was initiated. Note that corals and anemones may withdraw during treatment. Some Centropyge angels are sensitive to treatment also, Bivalves (e.g. clams & mussels) should be removed during treatment. To maximise results, halve the daily dose rate, adding it to the tank twice (morning and night).

What I read here is their own admission that this is not a cure for Marine Ich. I don't read where they say it cures the fish of this parasite. Rightly so, since it doesn't.

If you read between the lines they say it is safe for invertebrates and corals then proceed to list the invertebrates to protect. This is twisted marketing IMO.

There are only three ways to cure marine fish of Marine Ich: hyposalinity, a copper medication (preferably a protein complexed one, like Cupramine), and the transfer method.

If you want more help from me, you must to read this so we are talking from the same place:
Marine Ich - Myths and Facts

If you're interested in performing a copper treatment, then you should read this first:
Copper - Treatment, Use, Problems

To answer your question. . .I don't know. If I was using the proper treatment then there would be one of two answers. In a hyposalinity case you'd wait 4 or more weeks after the last sign of disease, to verify the disease was killed. Then raise the salinity and observe 4 more weeks at least. If it was a copper treatment, then after 2 weeks of treatment, all copper is removed and the fish is to be monitored for another 4 weeks to verify the disease is gone.

Since you're doing neither proper treatments, I don't know the answer to your question. Sorry.

Good luck!

[fergo]

you are right they do not claim to cure it, however, the fish has cleared up and in an amazing time.

i was just perplexed that it did not say how long i should treat him for? so if you had a fish, and you tried a treatment and it seemed to work... how long would you isolate him for it seems approx 4 weeks from your last post.

i have read the post on marine ich and on copper use. to be honest the copper treatment scares me a lot so im trying to avoid it.

[leebca]

In this case, 6 weeks.