Onyx Clown Fish - Won't Eat, fast breathing, and on bottom

[saumz]

Hello,

I have a pair of onyx clowns that I just got from a local shop.

The male isn't doing so good.

He started heavily breathing, not eating, and is starting to lay sideways on the bottom of the tank occasionally. All of this started today.

I went to the shop and got my water tested, all is good, pH is a little low and he provided me with some stabilizer to help raise the pH slowly and also gave me some of the food he was feeding him to see if he will start eating again.

The female is doing fine, no symptoms like these, but is staying by the male's side.

Any advise, tips, recommendations on how to treat this sick clown?

[leebca]

Although you've provided the information that your water tested properly, I in fact don't know that. I'd like to see the actual test results, including that for the pH.

A concern I have is that you are having your water tested by the store. Does this mean you don't test your own water? or is this just a check? Testing your own water is something that hobbyists just have to do, even though your local fish store/shop (LFS) offers to 'save you money' by doing this service. You need to do these measurements immediately and even at the times your LFS is closed. So, if you ware doing your own tests, list every test result for me.

You don't mention anything about your system, so I don't know if that is a problem or not. I don't know how you maintain your system -- what you do for maintenance.

You don't indicate how you acclimated these fish to your tank. I don't know, also, how your tank water differs from the water at the LFS. Lastly, I don't know how long your LFS has had these fishes, their actual size, etc., etc.

I understand you'd like some help, but. . .I don't have much to go on. From the information I don't have, there are a few dozen different things that can lead to what you see. Listing them won't do much good. So I'm stuck. I could speculate and do that until the fish, you, or I die.

This is the kind of information I will need to provide some help:

How old is your tank? When did it originally cycle?
What is the size (dimensions and gallonage) of your aquarium? Does the gallonage include the volume from the sump and any refugium?
Do you use carbon, skimmer, mechanical or other chemical filtration?.
List all specimens & sizes in the tank (fish, inverts, corals, clams, snails, crabs, shrimp, etc.).
Do you use a quarantine tank and procedure?
Foods you use and feeding schedules.
How long did your LFS have these fish?
How did you acclimate them – what procedure?
Do you use any vitamins? Fat additives? Any elemental or other additives? Please list all.
Chemistries – This is a very big gap of information. You said the pH wasn't right and you added chemicals to help change it. This means more than likely your water is not buffered properly. This means the Alkalinity, Calcium, and Magnesium are not properly balanced and since this is the case, you are not watching or controlling these things like they should be. So these hints lead me to suspect water quality may in fact be a contributing factor.
Water parameters – please give actual numbers (pH and your pH range, salinity or sp. gr. & range, temperature range)
Do you see any of the following in your system: hair algae; micro algae; cyanobacteria growths (red slime algae); dinoflagellate (zooxanthellae) growths; brown algae; diatom growth; slimes; off-colored patches on rock or substrate that are not coralline; etc.?
Water changes (how much and how often).
What is your source water? (Tap water, RO water, DI water, RO/DI, distilled, etc.)
List what you added or taken out of your aquarium system (living, decorations, and equipment) during the past 6 weeks.
Maintenance schedule. What have you done lately?

[saumz]

Sorry for not providing a lot of information, I am a first time poster and this is my first salt water aquarium (dangerous, I know).

Since the last post, we found out that the pH was low and the salinity was high. I have purchased the water from the owner of the shop, I did not mix my own. It was at 1.029, I have reduced it to 1.025 through water changes with D/IO water and measured with a refractometer.

I do have the male isolated from the female with a side-car on the tank at this time to reduce stress and to prevent her from eating him.

I had my water tested at the LFS due to me not having all of the testing materials at this time, I have Nitrate and Ammonia tests, I am purchasing more asap.

Here's some more information. My responses are below in red.

How old is your tank? 1 month

When did it originally cycle? 2 weeks ago

What is the size (dimensions and gallonage) of your aquarium? 28 Gal. Biocube

Does the gallonage include the volume from the sump and any refugium? Yes

Do you use carbon, skimmer, mechanical or other chemical filtration?. Protein Skimmer and carbon filtration

List all specimens & sizes in the tank (fish, inverts, corals, clams, snails, crabs, shrimp, etc.). Live rock, and one Stomatella varia that came with the rock, and one cluster of 3 Mushrooms (not sure on type, I have pics)

Do you use a quarantine tank and procedure? No

Foods you use and feeding schedules. frozen seafood and planet combination cubes. 1/4 cube. I mix this with the mysis that the store had been feeding them to help acclimate. Total amount is 1/2 cube of food. They are fed daily.

How long did your LFS have these fish? a few months

How did you acclimate them – what procedure? Tempered for half hour, half water change in bag, waited 15 minutes, another half water change in bag, waited 15 minutes. Released.

Do you use any vitamins? Fat additives? Any elemental or other additives? Please list all. None

Water parameters – please give actual numbers (pH and your pH range, salinity or sp. gr. & range, temperature range)

Salinity is now at 1.025 from 1.029
pH was at 7.9, brought up to 8.3 via pH buffer.
Nitrite - 0
Nitrate - 0
Ammonia - 0
Temp - 77.5 with light off, 78.6 with light on

Do you see any of the following in your system: hair algae; micro algae; cyanobacteria growths (red slime algae); dinoflagellate (zooxanthellae) growths; brown algae; diatom growth; slimes; off-colored patches on rock or substrate that are not coralline; etc.? Brown algae (I think) - minor growths on back wall of tank.

Water changes (how much and how often). Just did change to help with salinity, first change on tank.

What is your source water? (Tap water, RO water, DI water, RO/DI, distilled, etc.) DI water purchased from LFS

List what you added or taken out of your aquarium system (living, decorations, and equipment) during the past 6 weeks. Tank was setup a month ago with live rock. Piece of rock with cluster of 3 mushrooms added day after fish were added.

Maintenance schedule. What have you done lately? None as of yet

Also to note, the male has been pooping a long, transparent string of poop since he's been isolated in the side-car. Is this normal?

I am not sure if this is a concern, the female is currently staying at the top of the tank in the back "playing" on the surface of the tank. She is eating and breathing normally. Just stressed?

[leebca]

Thank you for the additional information. I can say, based upon your responses that the person or people providing you with advice, should not be blindly followed anymore.

The tank is too young for fish. Just because it cycled doesn't mean it is ready. There is more maturing to do. If you read this post, you'll get the best advice on starting an aquarium: Setting Up a FOWLR Aquarium

You'll note the differences between what you are doing and what is recommended in the above linked post.

We rate a 29 gallon aquarium good for one of the smaller species of Anemonefishes. For a pair of the smaller species, a slightly larger tank is preferred. If this is the only fish you plan to have in the 28 gallon cube, then it will be marginally okay. Just understand, the tank is now 'full.'

I will say that the choice of food is good.

The acclimation was not done in a way that is generally best for the fish. In certain circumstances, what you did may have been okay, but I don't see those circumstances laid out here. Generally, the total acclimation time if these fish were in separate bags should be about 3-4 hours. The procedure for acclimation is given here: It Was Acclimation, I know. . . Check the optimal way to acclimate fish there.

The pH should not be low like that unless there is a problem. Problems include not balancing the chemistries as noted in my last post, somethings are dead or dying off (very possible since this is one of the things that needs to 'age' in a new aquarium), or things unsettled. A new aquarium takes a few months to settle in and stabilize and stability is what these fish need.

Brown algae is one sign of a tank that has not matured yet.

Regarding water changes, you need some good guidance here. In that size tank and it being new and the fish being put in a bit sooner than they should, I'd suggest a 20% water change every two weeks for the next two months. Do you know how to make a proper water change? Please follow these guidelines for that: How to Make a Successful Water Change

DI water may be okay for fish, but not for more sensitive lifeforms. You see, DI water can still contain organics like fertilizer, antibiotics, pesticides, etc. You may wish to learn more about source water and then decide what you want to use, rather than what you've been encouraged to buy: WATER - Source and NSW If the DI water is further treated somehow, it may be okay.

The poop of your fish is not normal. I'm not surprised, since your LFS has had this fish for so long. It has had plenty of time to take on an intestinal parasite. Read this post then treat the fish as soon as it is eating properly: Strange Excrement from Fish -or- How to be a Super Pooper Snooper

The female is probably stressed from something you are not detecting, such as the fact the tank isn't mature yet. Also, it is trying to adjust to the new tank. These two are heaped on the fish as stress, which you properly guessed. You need to stop making changes to the tank in the way of adding livestock until the tank is properly matured, unless you want to rethink the matter now, and return one of the fish to the LFS to hold for a while.

Don't let the above appear to be overwhelming to you. In this hobby there is a LOT to learn and know. Few LFS have this information, since they are in the business, but don't keep a large number of fishes at the own home.

Take your time and read, read, and then read more. Ask questions, when you have them, of experienced hobbyists. Treat your LFS advice as counsel or suggestions, not as things you must or have to do. This is a list of links to posts on subjects you should become familiar with: Table/Contents - Link List

[saumz]

Thank you very much for the wealth of information, I greatly appreciate it. This is my first salt, and I know there is a lot to learn. I will be applying your tips and recommendations to my tank from here-on out.

At this time, is there anything I can do to help the little clown to start eating other than what I am doing now?

Here is a video I took yesterday of his behavior and condition.

YouTube - Onyx Clown - Stressed

[leebca]

Hard to tell what is the best thing to do. Stress can bring out Brooklynellosis, but breathing hard and not eating is only a part of those symptoms.

Since the fish was kept for quite some time it probably has a good fat reserve. Thus, it can live for a few weeks without eating.

Strive for the best and most stable water quality as you can. Perform a large water change, following the advice of the link I provided. The water change should be about 50%. If the fish seems to 'perk up' at all, do another 50% water change two days later. This can be repeated every two days until the fish begins to eat.

You can refer to this other post and try some of the 'tricks' therein to get the fish to eat: My New Fish Won't Eat! Tips but the best you can do is provide the best water quality, which is difficult in your situation.

Keep us informed as to what is happening.