Does my Power Blue Hippo have Ich?

[Odie]

I got this PBT from my LFS over the weekend and it has very small dots on its head. I have never had a fish with Ich before and asking if anyone can tell from my pics if this fish has ich. I did not quarantine the fish because the LFS said they had quarantined him for 4 weeks and Ich treat all of their new tangs. Also having problems getting him to eat. He will pick around on the ground and rocks for food but will not eat any flake or ms food. I am also concerned with the fact he always has his mouth open all the time. Is this normal for a PBT? my yellow tang does not express this behavior. He does not rub against rocks and seams very active with my yellow tang pushing him around while he settles in.

[FoMoCo Master Tech]

Hard to tell from the pictures. Do the white spots resemble grains of sand or salt? Do the spots seem to protrude from the skin? How's the fish's breathing? Are the spots also visible on the fins? Try to do a google image search if marine ich and see if the pictures resemble what your PBT displays.
If it is ich, you have a lot of work ahead of you. Good luck and let us know what you find.

I'm not sure about the mouth being open all the time...

[Odie]

I would say the spots are lean more to the size of a grain of salt, like the point of a needle. The fish shows no signs of breathing difficulty. There are also very tiny spots on the fins. I am having difficulty in finding some good ich pictures on a PBT. The fish is light in color so it is hard to get a good picture of the tiny spots. Hope he starts eating soon. Thanks for your help.

Hard to tell from the pictures. Do the white spots resemble grains of sand or salt? Do the spots seem to protrude from the skin? How's the fish's breathing? Are the spots also visible on the fins? Try to do a google image search if marine ich and see if the pictures resemble what your PBT displays.
If it is ich, you have a lot of work ahead of you. Good luck and let us know what you find.

I'm not sure about the mouth being open all the time...

[Mad Mead]

has he had a open wound at all. or have you had a big death in the tank. if so it could be a fungal infections. if it small white tufts of hair like filamentouse material. you would see it on a dead fish in your tank as well

[Mad Mead]

it looks as close as you can for this it all so looks very close to ich

[FoMoCo Master Tech]

If the spots look like grains of salt. Its probably ich. You'll have to make the ultimate diagnosis though.
PBT's are like ich magnets. If you do find that it has ich, all of you other fish have been exposed and have it as well. You'll have to treat all your fish and leave the display tank fishless for 8 weeks to allow the ich in the tank to die off. There's a comprehensive sticky in this forum for curing fish of MI. I've used the information from that sticky with great success. Read up and good luck.

[Odie]

No open wounds and no deaths in tank (Knock On Wood).

has he had a open wound at all. or have you had a big death in the tank. if so it could be a fungal infections. if it small white tufts of hair like filamentouse material. you would see it on a dead fish in your tank as well

[Odie]

Has anyone tried Seachem Paraguard for ICH treatment?

[FoMoCo Master Tech]

The only thing I've ever used was copper in a hospital tank.
If the stuff you're talking about is one of those "reef safe ich treatments" then don't waste your time or money. In fact. Most of those companies only claim that their product helps cure ich.
the three proven cures for ich are hyposalinity, copper, and the transfer method.

[leebca]

Odie,

Please read this post and follow it: Curing Fish of Marine Ich

The above link takes you to a post that will help you in your diagnosis and will give you the only realiable means of treatment.

;)

[Odie]

Ok, I got my quarantine tank set up and my PBT in the tank. Man was that a choir getting him out of my reef tank! I will start copper treatment tomorrow. I have to make a trip to my LFS for some meds and this will give him time to settle down a little in his new temp tank. I want to wait before I move the rest of my fish over. I don’t want to cause undue stress if I don’t have to. My biggest concern is now that my PBT is in a 10gal quarantine tank instead of my 110 DT wont that also cause distress? And is it smart to move all my fish into that small 10gal quaranteen tank for 8 weeks?

Other Fish: Pair of Gold Maroon Clowns, 1 Red Scooter Benny, 1 Yellow Tang, 1 Bicolor Blenny and 4 Green Chromises.

Plus Several Corals and inverts.

[Mad Mead]

treating the rest of the fish with same amount of treatment. could cause some problems ( the dose is too much for the a health fish to handle and cause death). I would place them in a different tank if you can. doing a weaker treatment on the health fish. all so Plus over crowding will stress them out more. then the ich will spread do to stress weakened fish. always ask your dealer where you got your fish from if they have had the same trouble and ask them for help.

[leebca]

Mad Mead,

You may be giving incorrect recommendations.

If the PBT was infected and put into the display tank, as Odie originally posted, then all fishes in that DT must be treated. The treatment level of copper is safe for all fishes, healthy or not.

Odie,

The smaller tank is not that stressful for the fish if the fish is alone and for the short duration of treatment and observation. What is the greater stress is the parasite and infection. So it is a matter of prioritizing the stressors. You handle the worst first and work your way down. The last stressor to remove is space, and for that you'll need a long tank, like a 125 or 180.

As for the 'other fishes' yes, that 10 gallon is too small for all of them. That group of fish, depending upon their size, need the right size of QT. You'll get information on what size tank is best in the post: A Fish Quarantine Process

The paired Marrons should definitely be in a QT all their own. So, don't be hesitant to setup and run multiple QTs. The fishes don't have to be all together.

[Odie]

So I need to purchase 2 more quarantine tanks and filtration and pumps for them? Also is it true that once I treat with copper I cannot use this equipment with anything that touches my DT again?

By the way I started CopperSafe Treatment on my PBT yesterday and he is fine so far.

Mad Mead,

You may be giving incorrect recommendations.

If the PBT was infected and put into the display tank, as Odie originally posted, then all fishes in that DT must be treated. The treatment level of copper is safe for all fishes, healthy or not.

Odie,

The smaller tank is not that stressful for the fish if the fish is alone and for the short duration of treatment and observation. What is the greater stress is the parasite and infection. So it is a matter of prioritizing the stressors. You handle the worst first and work your way down. The last stressor to remove is space, and for that you'll need a long tank, like a 125 or 180.

As for the 'other fishes' yes, that 10 gallon is too small for all of them. That group of fish, depending upon their size, need the right size of QT. You'll get information on what size tank is best in the post: A Fish Quarantine Process

The paired Marrons should definitely be in a QT all their own. So, don't be hesitant to setup and run multiple QTs. The fishes don't have to be all together.

[leebca]

Obtain whatever equipment you need to properly complete the treatment of all your fishes. Follow the linked post's guidelines.

CopperSafe has had a negative reputation in the hobby. Please maintain your copper levels in precisely the correct concentration.

Excess equipment can be cleaned and rid of traces of copper, although I recommend discarding all plastic equipment. As for the cleaning procedure, that is found in this post: Marine System Clean Up Recommendations

Good luck!

[schabiazabi]

the three proven cures for ich are hyposalinity, copper, and the transfer method.

What is a transfer cure method? What do you mean by that?

[FoMoCo Master Tech]

A description can be found at #7 under " treatment" in Lee's sticky: Marine Ich - Myths and Facts

IMO, that method is probably the most difficult/ stressful on you and the fish. Lots of moving around and having to put the fish under repeated stress from being caught/ transferred.

[schabiazabi]

^ Thanks god I did not have to read the Marine Ich sticky as of now. I quarantine everything.

But going back to the transfer method, something does not add up here. How do you cure the fish? If you move the fish with MI from tank1 to tank2, the fish will carry the problem to tank2. I just do not see how this method liberates the fish from the parasite. The sticky post does not talk about the details on how to actually do it.

[FoMoCo Master Tech]

I don't know a whole lot about the transfer method but ill try to explain what I do know.
It has to do with the life cycle of the parasite. Ich feeds on its host and becomes impregnated. After its done with its host, the parasite falls off and incubates in the sand bed/ on the rocks, etc... When ready, the cyst ruptures and hundreds (per cyst) of free swimming parasites go in search for a new host.
the transfer method is meant to remove the fish after the cysts have fallen off and place it in an ich free environment. At that point, the infected tank would have to be drained, cleaned, dried and filled with new seawater to be used again.
Once in the new tank, the cycle begins again( only in smaller numbers).
The goal is to transfer the fish to the new tank before the cysts in the old tank "hatch".
after the transfer method has been done enough times at the appropriate intervals ( I have no clue to these) all of the ich would have fallen off and there wouldn't have been enough time for the parasite to reinfect the fish.

[schabiazabi]

The goal is to transfer the fish to the new tank before the cysts in the old tank "hatch".

Now I get it. Before I assumed the cyst hatches when it falls off and infects the fish with new parasites right away. Yes, I can see this method work.