A variety of questions

[BoogeryIcecream]

Hello all! I've been a long time reader and as of today, a first time poster.
I've done Fowlr for about 3+ years now and haven't necessarily had any problems up until now.

So about a month ago I purchased a few containers of DT's Copepods and added it to my tank since I've noticed my pod population seemingly dropped significantly lower than I would like.
Shortly after adding the copepods to my tank, my tangs started to show signs of ich with rapid breathing and a few minor spots which at the time was nothing major to me.

I simply brought over one of my large containers and took out all my rock and moved my fish to a cycled quarantine tank for hyposalinity treatment and slowly lowered the salinity over a period of 4 days via dripping in a corner with heavy aeration.

So here's my first question. Did the water that the copepods came in give my fish ich?! or did I screw up in quarantining my fish all those years back and never noticed?

My Second question, is it okay to use crushed coral to aid in/simplify pH buffering in my QT tank along with Sodium Carbonate which I'm already using?

Third, would it be okay to use dry base rock for my fish to hide since for some odd reason they've been reluctant to enter any of the PVC pipes despite the fact that they've encountered them long ago in past quarantining. As of now they seem to prefer clustering together in the corner as of right now excluding feeding time.

Anywho, here's the specs of my QT tank.
100G 48x24x20
SG 1.007-1.009 (Sometimes I accidentally go a bit lower on the SG but seems like no harm has been done so far) - using refractometer calibrated with 35ppt solution
Ammonia: 0
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: 20ppm-40ppm
pH 8.0-8.02

All test are done with Salifert/API/Digital Testing equipment/Kits and all ammonia and pH test are done twice a day or 3 times a day when I change water.

For filtration and such I have:
A Rena XP4 Canister Filter with Sponges,Ceramic Rings (Don't worry! you won't find these anywhere near my main tank), and Microfiltration pads which after I introduced the fish have been cleaning at least twice weekly to keep nitrates and organics down.
2 Extra Large Sponge filters
A ton of PVC pipe elbows and such for fish to (NOT) hide in.

And for fish in the quarantine I have:
1 Adult Emperor Angelfish
3 Blue Hippo Tangs
2 Gold Stripe Maroons
1 Leopard Wrasse
1 Coral Beauty Angelfish
1 Flame Angelfish

And for feeding I use:
New Life Spectrum Reg/Med/LG Thera A+ formula (1-3mm)
Fresh Gracilaria that I grow outside in a clear plastic tub I got from Walmart.
Algae Sheets (Including Nori when I run out of all my other ones)


Any advice or ideas as to why or how whatever happened would be much obliged!

[schabiazabi]

My post may not help you, but I have some interesting observation for you.

Few weeks ago I woke up and I see hundreds or small white bugs on the glass of my tank. I do some research and it turns out I have copepod bloom. I was told this is a sign of a healthy tank. It made me happy and I enjoyed my Tangs eat those copepods from the walls.

Later I did more research and I realized out of 5000 different copepods 2000 of the them is parasitic. It did not take long for them to show up on my fish (Hippo Tangs). It looks very much similar to Marine Ich, but it comes off after few hours as those copepods are not deeply placed at all. My fish flashes once or twice per week from those small bugs, but that's about it. I decided to let them be for now as the fish are doing great anyway.

Btw the heavy breathing on some small fish is normal to me. My tiny Hippo Tangs do breath faster than larger fish for 2 months now as they are super young with a very fast metabolism. I'm assuming the breathing will slow down as they grow larger.

I'm not ruling out Marine Ich in your case, but I know for sure 2000 different types of copepods are parasitic. Show us some pictures.

Also, I did not purchase any copepods at all. They came with live rock as I'm a big fan of having the real "ocean" in my tanks. I enjoy all those creatures.

[BoogeryIcecream]

My post may not help you, but I have some interesting observation for you.

Few weeks ago I woke up and I see hundreds or small white bugs on the glass of my tank. I do some research and it turns out I have copepod bloom. I was told this is a sign of a healthy tank. It made me happy and I enjoyed my Tangs eat those copepods from the walls.

Later I did more research and I realized out of 5000 different copepods 2000 of the them is parasitic. It did not take long for them to show up on my fish (Hippo Tangs). It looks very much similar to Marine Ich, but it comes off after few hours as those copepods are not deeply placed at all. My fish flashes once or twice per week from those small bugs, but that's about it. I decided to let them be for now as the fish are doing great anyway.

Btw the heavy breathing on some small fish is normal to me. My tiny Hippo Tangs do breath faster than larger fish for 2 months now as they are super young with a very fast metabolism. I'm assuming the breathing will slow down as they grow larger.

I'm not ruling out Marine Ich in your case, but I know for sure 2000 different types of copepods are parasitic. Show us some pictures.

Also, I did not purchase any copepods at all. They came with live rock as I'm a big fan of having the real "ocean" in my tanks. I enjoy all those creatures.

Well at this point I'm 2 weeks into Hyposalinity and the last spot I saw was about a week ago, so basically I have about 5 or more weeks to go before everyone is good to go. Before the introduction of the copepods, I never had anything remotely close to a parasitic copepod luckily, and I quarantined prior to introduction of all my fish for more diseases and stuff than I can count on my fingers and I highly doubt DT sells parasitic copepods to us.
My original set of copepods came with my LR too, just recently the population went through a crash (well huge drop) presumably due to way too much interbreeding (although I would assume it's unusual since my display is a 240 gallon with a 60g sump + 40g refugium connected) and I know it's not the leopard wrasse eating them all because it's been in the tank for about 2 years by now without the population dropping even nearly as much as it did randomly one day.

Another note for parasitic copepods, I would assume they need an immediate host to survive unlike the regular copepods or some isopods. I doubt most of them would survive my initial tank cycle of 4 months without food or a host or my fish probably would've shown the signs of them in these past 3 years considering emperor angelfish = easy parasite target "said the flukes" but don't quote me on this since I'm hardly a micro-organism specialist.
I hate to be one to judge or seem rude (Not intentionally) but I would assume rapid breathing for any fish would be a sign of some form of stress that should be looked into.

[leebca]

To get right to your questions, BoogeryIcecream:

1. If the copepod population came from a system with fish in it, they may have very well brought with them fish parasites. I try to make sure when I buy pod supplements that they are grown out, free of marine fishes.

2. Please set up your QT as recommended -- no carbonates at all -- no substrate and no rock (live or dead). The reasons are clearly given in the sticky that recommends how to set up a QT.

3. If they wanted to hide, they'd use the PVC, so there are a few possibilities the most common of which are: the PVC is not sized properly (can the fish go inside without folding back its dorsal fin?); the PVC was not cleaned properly and is giving off some residual chemical they sense; and a more often commonly overlooked/not thought of one -- the PVC doesn't seem to be secure.

Good luck!

[BoogeryIcecream]

To get right to your questions, BoogeryIcecream:

1. If the copepod population came from a system with fish in it, they may have very well brought with them fish parasites. I try to make sure when I buy pod supplements that they are grown out, free of marine fishes.

2. Please set up your QT as recommended -- no carbonates at all -- no substrate and no rock (live or dead). The reasons are clearly given in the sticky that recommends how to set up a QT.

3. If they wanted to hide, they'd use the PVC, so there are a few possibilities the most common of which are: the PVC is not sized properly (can the fish go inside without folding back its dorsal fin?); the PVC was not cleaned properly and is giving off some residual chemical they sense; and a more often commonly overlooked/not thought of one -- the PVC doesn't seem to be secure.

Good luck!

Thanks Lee!
I guess DT's copepods do come from a system with the ich parasite existing in there. Probably a good idea to find a different supplier then whenever the need comes, or keep them alive for about 2 months then add them.
For the QT, I guess there is no way I can do anything lazy this time around, oh well I've been doing the baking soda drip since I started Hypo a while ago anyways, it's not too much more work really.
As for the PVC pipes, I highly doubt it's chemical related unless they start releasing some after being in water for about 3 years? Size would be understandable for my angel who about an inch too big to fit in one of those, while everyone else fits just fine.
It does sound likely that it would be a security thing since the emperor doesn't even come close to the pvc pipes now = everyone else might not feel its safe in that sense.

But if I can't add base rock pieces for them to feel secure, where can I find a PVC pipe that's big enough to fit a about a 6'' high emperor angelfish?

[leebca]

Pipes come in all sizes. You just need a larger supplier that caters to the industrial plumbers. Search the Internet, too. If you can, find some tank decoration that may work. I bought up many of the fake 'pipe' decorations in all sizes to use, in addition to PVC.

Sometimes, especially in the case of the large Angeles, they would just like something between them and you, so something to hide behind sometimes will work just as well.