Stiff African Red Seastar- Is he dying

[Danette-N-Dakota]

My African Red Star's typical day is always on the glass at the top of the tank with one arm breaking the waters surface. He comes down and moves rather quickly for a star across the substrate and rocks and climbs back up on the glass on a different side of the tank. Yesterday I came home from work (12hr shift) and he was lying on a rock with all five arms out straight. Not moving, didn't see suction cups moving either. I thought maybe he died but then saw a couple suction cups move. Fed him by placing a tiny piece of scallop under his center. He ate but not much cup mvmt. Did a PWC (7gallons) and placed a sm piece of shrimp under him. Had gone out for 6 hours came back and he hadn't moved or ate the shrimp, saw no suction cups. Red crab under him picking at him. Thought he died for sure, took him out of the water (<5secs) and looked at his underside (was going to dispose of him)all channels closed up tight, but remembered the upside down thing. Immediately put him in tank upside down and he did right himself slowly and climbed back on wall 1/4 way up. Today, at the top & moved left to right side.Why was he stiff for so long and did I hurt him by taking him out of the water? He has been leaving strands of "clear spit" on the glass too? Any ideas? Is he dying but got a little energy again after eating. Nitrates20-40 ppm before & 20ppm after PWC (can never get it<20)nitrites-0,Alkalinity-300ppm,Ph-7.8, temp 78deg. Parameters same since day one of introducing him. Feed him fresh scallop or shrimp every 4 days.

[Kmoriarty]

I'm no pro with starfish but since they're inverts I know they are very sensitive to high nitrates. If yours were between 20-40 that's REALLY high. Aside from the nitrates i think we'd need more info...tank size, equipment, livestock, etc?

[Danette-N-Dakota]

Sorry I thought that info was obtainable from my profile. I have a 28g tank, Penguin PH, Marine-land bio-wheel 150 (i hate it! makes alot of noise), 20lb LR, 1 clown, 1 damsel, 1 blenny, 1 fire shrimp, 1 emerald crab, 5 red leg hermits, the star. And the light that came with the tank kit, 15W fluorescent. I have sand substrate (not live). Also any ideas besides water changes to get nitrates down? Mine are always 20 before and after changes.

[Kmoriarty]

Mine were like that for a while until I decided to convert to reef...I bought a skimmer and voilà...nitrates are around 5ppm. Also if you're using tap water that could be the source so switch to RODI if you are. Another thing it could be is that you have quite a few fish in that small tank with not enough live rock...I would add like 10-15 more pounds and ditch the biofilter...the biofilter will oftentimes become a nitrate factory unless cleaned once or twice a week. If you get up to 30-35lbs of live rock, that will be a good enough biological filter. What I did was remove the biomedia from my mechanical filter and I just use it for carbon and water movement.

In summary...these three factors are important:

Ditch the biofilter
Add a few more pounds of live rock
And add a skimmer

In a matter of a week you'll see them dissappear.

[Original Fin]

Mine were like that for a while until I decided to convert to reef...I bought a skimmer and voilà...nitrates are around 5ppm. Also if you're using tap water that could be the source so switch to RODI if you are. Another thing it could be is that you have quite a few fish in that small tank with not enough live rock...I would add like 10-15 more pounds and ditch the biofilter...the biofilter will oftentimes become a nitrate factory unless cleaned once or twice a week. If you get up to 30-35lbs of live rock, that will be a good enough biological filter. What I did was remove the biomedia from my mechanical filter and I just use it for carbon and water movement.

In summary...these three factors are important:

Ditch the biofilter
Add a few more pounds of live rock
And add a skimmer

In a matter of a week you'll see them dissappear.

+1. Solid advice and a good place to start. There are other tricks if that doesn't quite do it, but cross that bridge when you come to it.

[Kmoriarty]

Thanks Fin...I've learned from you Leeb and a few others. Just sharing the love .

[Danette-N-Dakota]

I may sound stupid but I thought that you should allow 1 gallon of water per inch of fish. I was told the CUC doesn't get included in this equation. Does the "Starfish", shrimp and crab get included in the equation too? Total inches of "fish" including star and shrimp not hermit crabs or emerald crab would equal 15inches. Is that too much? I guess it's time to look into a protein skimmer. That was one mess I was hoping nature would take care of so I wouldn't have to. Also, I use "real ocean water" in a box at Petco and mix Distilled water to bring salinity to 1.024.
Just FYI... Ringo Star is doing great, haven't seen any problem with him since that day. It was really weird.
Thanks again for everyones help. I am new to all this. I look to the forum for support and it's nice to know that someone is willing to lend advice.

[Kmoriarty]

No problem. The 1 inch per gallon is a total myth too by the way. Take a look at one of the stickies on here about bioload. To give you a very rough estimate it's more like 1 inch per 4-6 gallons. It all has to do with the type, size, shape, and eating habits if fish...not just length.

Glad to hear the starfish is well though. Best of luck.