[angel101]

While nothing has been confirmed yet, it would seem that all collection of coral and live rock will be banned on the GBR by the end of the year. Nothing has been officially confirmed yet, but an announcement is expected by thursday. Obviously this does not affect you guys in the States, but watch out, fish collection will be next. If this happens our hobby will dead by the years end.

[The_Bandit]

Hey guys,

Thought you might want to have a look at this... if it is true (And Diver1 is an LFS owner) then it looks as though reef aquariums are no longer going to contain Australian coral !!!

Click Here to Read More

Just goes to show the morons we elect over here

I will post more details (including Senator Hill's email address) once I know more.
--------

Jamie
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[angel101]

Still no confirmation, but the word has spread around the country and reefers here are outraged. We have had no warning and no input. There are going to be hundreds of collectors and retailers put out of work as a result of this. Some people might say "so what, just propagate." If the LFS can't stock corals, then they will not stock dry goods, such as MH lighting and skimmers etc and those left in the hobby will go under. Our market is small enough as it is and distributors will not bother to bring hardware into the country if this decision goes ahead. Watch out, you guys will be next!! Bush is not adverse to cheap political stunts either!!!

[Mikeman]

I'm sorry guys but I don't think Bush will ban our trade in the states, why don't you export from figi? just a q

[The_Bandit]

Ahhh, because Fiji is it's own country

Please be aware that Australia bans ALL invert imports due to strict quarantine laws here. Remember we are an island nation, and don't have the infectious diseases like rabies, typhoid etc over here.

If the coral farms around Australia get closed, Australian reefers will not be able to obtain ANY coral.

What will be worse though, is that it looks like this is the first step in the master plan to prevent any sort of collecting from the GBR.... which means no more GBR fish for you guys

Fingers crossed we can win the war

[Mikeman]

thanks for the info

I guess you don't want a rabbit in the ocean

[BigA]

My reef now will contain very few wild caught/collected fish and inverts. I try to buy only captive stuff anyway.

We are going to have to deal with zero or near zero impact captive mini reefs in the future... It's better that it starts a little at a time.

Just think how stupid they'll feel when they find out how little impact this hobby has on the natural reefs.

~BigA

[tubs]

Wow,

Really sorry to hear about this and is coming sooner than I would have thought. I thought banning caulerpa in California was already a big deal.

The future for all of us however is some form of aquaculture whether it is a network of hobbyists, closed systems aquaculture or open systems aquaculture and it probably is all that - at least for corals. It would be much more difficult for fish however at least as far as providing properly sized and appropriate diets.

What even makes it all the more difficult for such a succesful venture is the specialized nature of our market meaning there is a substantial investment for such a relatively small market.

[reptilicus]

I urge all of you to help us out as much as possible. Australians are already doing there bit for obvious reasons. However, I believe it is of international concern. If the politicians of other "developed" nations see what is going on, they may be pushed by uneducated popular opinion to enforce similar bans in their own countries. Judging by the Caulerpa thing in California, the US could be next. You may not have a hobby in the future if you do not fight now. It is the responsibility of all hobbyists. I urge all of you to write to Senator Robert Hill and inform him of all the good the hobby does in terms of caprtive propagation and breeding of marine organisms. Tell him that they can be used to re-stock natural reefs. Tell him that so much of our knowledge of breeding/propagating marine organisms has come from hobbyists, not scientists. There would be no one keeping Acropora to restock natural populations today if it were not for reef hobbyists. Let your voice be heard before it is too late.
Unfortunately, Senator Robert Hill does not have the cranial capacity to operate e-mail. However, he can be faxed if you wish (his fax number can be found easily with a quick search), or else you can either post the letter here, I will print and fax it off to him, or you can e-mail it directly to me, my address can be found in my details.
Regards,
Tom

[SPasse]

Hi All,

I have been talking too a lot of the retailers and they are getting more and more “nervous” about pending legislation that could finish off our hobby.

As I have posted related to the CA Caulerpa ban issue, there is a considerable “camp” among certain scientists and biologists to push for a ban on private ownership of all non native species. This would effect many pets beside saltwater fish.

Regards,

Scott

[angel101]

Simply saying that propagation is the answer is too simplistic. If the local Lfs cannot stock a wide variety of corals, then it will not stock dry goods either. Sure existing reefers in this country will be able to battle on, but when we go to the LFs to get that replacement MH lamp, either it will not be there, or it will cost $250.00. At this stage propagation has no hope of supplying the needs of the stores in terms of corals. Because we have had no warning there is no chance of this happening, even in the long term. As a consequence, there will be little or no new entry into the hobby and it will die.

[tubs]

Angel I agree with you that it is simplistic and if it was the only choice then reefing would become an even more of a niche market if not disappear altogether.

[wgscott]

Well, coral collection and live rock collection are banned in US waters, and it hasn't destroyed the hobby hear. If I had to pick one reef to try to preserve, it would be the GBR. I think the smartest thing to do would be to push for tax breaks for those collectors who would be put out of business if they start a captive prop. coral farm. The hobby will doubtless change, but I don't think it will simply disappear. Almost all of my stuff is captive propagated, and even though I had the option of buying wild-collected corals, I thought it was a bad idea both ecologically and in terms of the hardiness of the species. Every day we see threads about some idiot LFS selling stuff that can't possibly survive in captivity. The "industry" obviously won't police themselves, so it is good that somene will before it is too late.

[MaryHM]

wgscott: You're comparing apples to elephants. The US hobby hasn't been affected by the banning of coral collection in US waters because we IMPORT everything. Australia doesn't have that luxury. Their laws do not allow the import of non-native species. No coral collection in Australian waters=No hobby in Australia.

[Rin]

This issue has the great potential of spinning out of control. Once the GBR is off-limits, this will increase pressure on others areas, forcing those countries to either impose similar bans or see their resources dwindle to meat an insatiable market demand.

Then there's the black market. No longer will we see the regulated trade that we enjoy today. Black marketers, to escape notice, will collect as much as they can in as short a period as they can. This means techniques like cyanide and explosives will rise. Containers will be redesigned to smuggle fish rather than protect them during transport. The few pathetic fish that make it to market will fetch prices several times what we see today.

Getting back to the bans on collection...how will authorities know that a particular coral is propagated or wild-caught? No, this will be too difficult for them. Legislation will probably ban ownership of like species of coral and fish, as well.

Reptile people already operate like this and now it's threatening come to the aquaria folks, too. I wonder if CITES will be expanded to include many marine animals, as well.

*sigh* How depressing.

[BTL]

Concerning the US hobby being abolished, i dont think that it will ever come to that. This same fear circulates in reptile circles from time to time but i think it is just a bad rumor. The US govt will not pass legislation that will put a sector of their working force out of busness because it will strain the unemployment and welfare departments. The marine aqarium hobby is HUGE in the US (bigger than the reptile hobby) and if this ban is inacted it will cause not only Importers to go out of business but the LFS's, Aquarium Companies, food companies, and everything else that is tied up in this hobby and any legislation that would destroy the lively hood of these people would probally be considered "Unconstitutional". I have heard that the Govt wanted to make taxes much simpler in the past so they wouldnt get so much flak from the people about how complex and frustrating they are. This idea was scrapped because if taxes were extremly simple to do many of the accountants in the country would be put out of business because alot of them get alot of their money from filing tax returns.

And regulation of this would also be extremly hard so if they actually wanted to make a bill like this succeed they would probally have to ban the keeping of all fish which would create even more of a disastarous situation.
So, to end this rambling mess i will say that i dont think america will do anything to harm any part of their small business sector, including the marine aquarium hobby.


My 2 cents,

Andy

[reptilicus]

wgscott,
The reason the ban in America on coral collection has not caused any harm to the hobby is because it is extremely hypocritical. Basically put, it's "we'll look like we're being all environmental and save our reefs while plundering the reefs of third world countries". Perhaps I am being slightly harsh, if so then I will just put the point that due to strict quarantine laws in Australia prevent us from importing any invertebrates, as MaryHM has pointed out. So it would lead to the dath of our hobby.
Remember that Australia has only 18 million people, not 280 million like the US. This means a much smaller marine aquarium market. Thi in turn means that not only is coral harversting much more sustainable, but it is much harder to make any money out of caprive propagation, as there is just not the market to support it. We hobbysists and some LFS and collectors do what we can, a lot of my reef is captively propagated as well, however to set up a captive propagation business is really not feasible as the costs involved would far outweigh the income from such a small market.
The other aspect of this is that because of the small market the amount collected is minimal. The avaerage amount of coral allowed to be collected from the GBR each year 50 tonnes, which is ONE MILLIONTH!! of the total amount of coral produced by the GBR each year, 50 000 000 tonnes! Even this figure is substantially more than the actual amount taken, which is somewhere in the vicinity of 15 tonnes. This fishery is incredibly sustainable and at a world conference in Jakarta in April was used as an example to the rest of the world for a sustainable coral industires. Experts such as J.E.N. Veron also point to the long-term sustainability of the fishery.
This is not to say that captive propagation should not be encouraged. I propagate my corals as much as I can, and may of my corals are/have grown from fragments I have received from other aquarists. However, due to the fact that captive propagation is not a feasible long-term economic venture, the future of our hobby in Australia is highly dependent on the collection of a sustainable harvest of corals from the GBR.
Regards,
Tom

[angel101]

Right on Tom!!!!!!!

[BigA]

The US is not Australia...our attitudes are not the same.

Didn't Australia ban most guns a few years ago? Did crime rates increase? Yes.

The NRA tried to help save the gun rights of the people of Australia without success.

I don't think there is a thing we can do about the pending Legislation in Australia.

~BigA

[reefhead]

It Is Enevitable