something very strange

[Samper]

How do you sex an anemone?

[zhenya]

How do you sex an anemone?

Well, it is a good question. In case of the E.quad I think you'd be able to see eggs in the bulbs at the end of the tentacles.At least in the wild you should be able to. Some of the E.quadricolor lose those bulbs in captivity so it would be difficult, I think. However, if spawning occurs, you should be able to tell as eggs would be in the water column everywhere.

[Samper]

I know earlier you said that you noticed that their feet expanded to a pretty large size and that they had short tentacles but did you not notice anything else say a few days prior? Also these may be dumb questions but how do you know that all of yours are males?

[Ninong]

Well, it is a good question. In case of the E.quad I think you'd be able to see eggs in the bulbs at the end of the tentacles.At least in the wild you should be able to. Some of the E.quadricolor lose those bulbs in captivity so it would be difficult, I think. However, if spawning occurs, you should be able to tell as eggs would be in the water column everywhere.

Gene,

I think what you observed was sperm in the water column everywhere. You may not even have any females in your tank. Didn't you start out with a single Entacmaea quadricolor specimen that later cloned?

E. quadricolor does not release eggs. The sperm enters the females through the water column and the eggs are fertilized internally. A few days later the embryos migrate to the tentacle tips where they are released. So if you have any female anemones in your tank, you can expect to see greenish spheres in the tips of the tentacles in about three or four days. These embryos/planulae are released via the tentacle tips into the water column.

[Ninong]

Also these may be dumb questions but how do you know that all of yours are males?

One way to tell would be to witness them releasing sperm into the water column. Another way to know that they are not males would be to witness round colored spheres (embryos) in the tips of the tentacles being released into the water column.

E. quadricolor has at least two and possibly three strains. I think Gene has the smaller strain that tends to clone. There is a larger, solitary strain of E. quadricolor that is the host for Premnas biaculeatus and that one is thought to prefer sexual reproduction. Some people classify them according to whether they are shallow water specimens or deeper water specimens but Joyce Wilkerson in her book, Clownfishes, makes three different distinctions.

You can also look at the anemones to see if you can see the gonads. Females have a darkened patch near the central most edges of the septa running from the body wall to the pharynx. According to Dr. Ron Shimek, the gonads are relatively easy to see in carpet anemones because the animals are thin from top to bottom but much harder to see in cylindrical anemones such as E. quadricolor. You need to look down through the mouth at the edges and adjacent areas of the septa coming out from the body walls.

According to Dr. Ron, if the animal is near spawning condition, the gonads may be visible through the body wall. They will be white in the males and colored in the females. He also goes on to say that most anemone eggs are colored by the lipids in their yolk, generally pink, rose, green, etc.

I was unable to find anything in Dr. Ron's writings about the exact method of sexual reproduction in this particular species, E. quadricolor, but I did find it in a couple of other sources. According to Fautin & Allen (1992) some host anemones' eggs are fertilized internally and some are not. http://biodiversity.uno.edu/ebooks/ch34.html

Then I managed to find eye witness accounts of spawning in a tank devoted to several specimens of E. quadricolor that confirmed that it is one of those species whose eggs are fertilized internally: http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issu...02/feature.htm

[Samper]

I"m about to read the articles you gave but I thought of a question before I start. When an anemone splits is it a true clone? What I mean by that is the animal the exact same as the previous animal? Can an anemone split and be a female instead of the male it split from?

[Samper]

Ok I found the answer to my own question...........it is a true clone. I could open up a nasty can of worms with this conversation about cloning but I won't.

[zhenya]

Gene,

I think what you observed was sperm in the water column everywhere. You may not even have any females in your tank. Didn't you start out with a single Entacmaea quadricolor specimen that later cloned?

I agree that it was sperm everywhere and I never said that I have a female E.quadricolor. Here's what I said:

Nothing good can happen out of this since all I have is bunch of males

And yes, all this clones are from a single anemone which happens to be a male.
I'm sure I would have much more on my hands to deal with if it was females and eggs would be released. Kevin(Anemone) said that all his fish survived just fine but his three Trochus snails never moved again after water cleared.And that nutrients load was really high.
So far, mine are all fine. I have one large Trochus and about four small Astraeas and I can see all grazing as before.

Come to think of it, George, I did see the gonads loading with sperm but I never paid much attention to the coloration on the foot.I just noticed that it was unusually large,roughly 6" in diameter( like it was swollen). I went upstairs shortly after that and returned when lights were off to add some water to the sump( in about 30 minutes or less).

Anyhow, the event is over and tank's water is all clear and it appears that all are doing fine this morning.

PS. I forgot to add that the skimmer began to work properly again this morning. I cleaned the beckett last night and pump but it didn't help at all. I didn't find anythng in the beckett except some salt creep which I cleaned easily with vinegar.There was no small shells or sand or the anemone sperm in there. It is working just fine this morning though. I wonder what's up with that? J/K.

[Ninong]

When an anemone splits is it a true clone? What I mean by that is the animal the exact same as the previous animal?

When an anemone splits, both resulting animals are identical. That is the nature of asexual reproduction. Sexual reproduction, by definition, involves genetic material (gametes) from two different sources as opposed to asexual reproduction.

Cloned animals, of any species, cannot change or evolve because there is no new input of genetic material, no possibility for mutation, no possibility for improvement of the species. Cloning is an evolutionary dead end. Sexual reproduction is much better equipped to meet the challenges of a changing environment because of the flexibility inherent in its nature.

P.S. -- Why would a discussion of cloning be any different than a discussion of any other topic?

[zhenya]

.....it is a true clone. I could open up a nasty can of worms with this conversation about cloning but I won't.

Thank you. That type of cloning has nothing to do with this discussion. ;)

[Samper]

Cloning is one of those topics that can get heated is all I meant.

[Papa Doug]

Looks like a spawn to me also Gene. The anenome pictured in my friends 180 soft tank, has done that a few times now. I dont think it has in the year or so its been in the 180g though.

[zhenya]

Looks like a spawn to me also Gene. The anenome pictured in my friends 180 soft tank, has done that a few times now. I dont think it has in the year or so its been in the 180g though.

Doug, I can verify that it was a spawn becouse I had to clean up this mess :eek3:
And, I think I'm old enough to see the difference and old enough to complain about it

[Poseidon]

Gene, you are my new HERO!!! I think I would have had a problem sticking my arms into all the Anemone SPLOOOGE!!!! EWWW!!!

[Elmo18]

Wow Gene! That must have been an interesting sight to see. Definitely looks like spawning event as well. Your Rose anemones must like being in there

- Elmo

[zhenya]

Well, last update. The tank has cleared up and looks like nothing ever happened.

The stupid clownfish is faning the sand more than usual but otherwise things are back to normal.

Here's pic I took today.

[Papa Doug]

Doug, I can verify that it was a spawn becouse I had to clean up this mess :eek3:
And, I think I'm old enough to see the difference and old enough to complain about it

:eek3: