[apantale]

Hi Guys,

Well, I was almost certain that Mushrooms are the most hardiest of corals, but today I noticed that the rock that I had with about 7 green mushrooms looks like there are now only 5!! The other two are disintegrating into a gelatenous form. Are they dying? How the heck did that happen? PH is about 8.2, temp is 78, lighting is more than enough (2x65 Orbit), current is moving, dosing Reef Solutions daily, NH03 is practically zero.. Any reason why they appear to be disappearing before my eyes. I tried to move the rock into an area with less current and not too much light..

[kevinpo]

Possibly being eaten by something during the night? As you say they are pretty hardy. They can be easily kept under NO bulbs, so lighting is not an issue. Some rock crabs and butterflyfish will eat them.

Regards,
Kevin

[apantale]

I have a mandarin fish, false percula, royal gramma, and a yellow goby. Any of these culprits? I wouldnt think so, but I could also be very wrong.. I dont think I have any crabs..bristleworms or polychaete..

[apantale]

Sorry, I meant I might have bristleworms and I do have a polychaete..I saw it..millipede looking thing

[Reefland]

No, I don't think any of those would be the culprits. Let's go back a couple of steps. How long have you had these muchrooms?

[marxsman]

make sure you use a iodide suppliment in the tank, a necessity for mushrooms.

Originally Posted by Reefland

No, I don't think any of those would be the culprits. Let's go back a couple of steps. How long have you had these muchrooms?

[apantale]

Originally Posted by Reefland

No, I don't think any of those would be the culprits. Let's go back a couple of steps. How long have you had these muchrooms?

I just bought them 4 days ago, and I have been losing one mushroom a day?

[Reefland]

I wouldn't be so quick to add any additive as a must, unless it is something to maintain calcium and alkalinity. Iodine probably isn't needed and shouldn't be added unl;ess you test first.

For your shroom problem, it could possibly be that the tank they came from have significantly different water parameters than your tank and the acclimation (if any) wasn't sufficient. Do you know what the salinity and temp were in the tank they came from or more importantly, how they differed from yours? This is a possible culprit.

[marxsman]

Reefland,
not to be rude and take over the thread. but I read a long time ago that iodine is a necessary supplement for the mushrooms. I have been using it for years and my mushrooms are doing quite well. ( see the picture I left in the Names and faces thread)
Is this a bad thing and should I quite using the supplement once a week?
I use Lugols solution and it really seems to work.

Originally Posted by Reefland

I wouldn't be so quick to add any additive as a must, unless it is something to maintain calcium and alkalinity. Iodine probably isn't needed and shouldn't be added unl;ess you test first.

For your shroom problem, it could possibly be that the tank they came from have significantly different water parameters than your tank and the acclimation (if any) wasn't sufficient. Do you know what the salinity and temp were in the tank they came from or more importantly, how they differed from yours? This is a possible culprit.

[Reefland]

marxsman,

Adding Iodine is not a problem unless you are adding too much, increasing your levels above NSW levels. Iodine, above NSW levels, is very toxic.

About 3 years ago there was a study performed on 23 hobbyists tank water. Out of these 23 submissions, the person with the lowest concentration of Iodine had over double NSW levels, the highest was over 34 times natural amounts. Here is a link to the study; note that some of the participants added iodine regularly, others never have:
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2002-0...ture/index.htm

Another study on foods added to reef tanks was performed to analyze their contents and the study showed that these foods contain more iodine than is needed, so as long as your feeding your tank regularly, you are adding iodine in concentrations already higher than NSW.
http://web.archive.org/web/200306081...data/foods.asp

I am not suggesting that Iodine is bad and shouldn't be added, I am suggesting that if you are interested in dosing iodine, you should test first to make sure your not adding to an already elevated level that could be harmful.

[apantale]

Originally Posted by Reefland

I wouldn't be so quick to add any additive as a must, unless it is something to maintain calcium and alkalinity. Iodine probably isn't needed and shouldn't be added unl;ess you test first.

For your shroom problem, it could possibly be that the tank they came from have significantly different water parameters than your tank and the acclimation (if any) wasn't sufficient. Do you know what the salinity and temp were in the tank they came from or more importantly, how they differed from yours? This is a possible culprit.

I believe that these two items, Salinity and Temp, were definitely different. Hmmmm. Acclimation is based on what? Length of time in the bag for temperature, then slowing passing the new tank water over the specimens until the bag water is equal to the tank water?

Thanks for all of your guys input on this. As for iodine, what would you suggest as a good brand to use, and in what proportions should I dose? I am using the B-Ionic two stage process daily, and using Reef Solutions from Ecosystems every other day.

[Reefland]

Yes, acclimation is the process in which you get the water that the coral or fish is in to be exactly the same water as what is in your tank, or should I say levels, over a period of time...not just temperature.

On the Iodine, read my post above.

[Ninong]

Originally Posted by apantale

Sorry, I meant I might have bristleworms and I do have a polychaete..I saw it..millipede looking thing

Bristleworms are polychaetes.

When dosing B-Ionic, be very careful that it dissolves in a fast moving current or the sump (if you have one). Also, wait at least a couple of minutes between components. Don't dose this stuff too near your mushrooms.

[Ninong]

Originally Posted by apantale

I believe that these two items, Salinity and Temp, were definitely different. Hmmmm. Acclimation is based on what? Length of time in the bag for temperature, then slowing passing the new tank water over the specimens until the bag water is equal to the tank water?

Acclimation is based on EVERYTHING: Lighting, temperature, salinity, pH, and ALL of the various chemical parameters that might be different between the original water and your tank's water. Some animals, such as echinoderms and mollusks, are extremely sensitive to changes in salinity and they may require very lengthy acclimation procedures if the differences in salinity are significant. Acclimation times as long as 6 to 8 hours are often required for such animals. Most other animals can be acclimated in a hour or two depending on the particular circumstances.

You can equalize the temperature by floating the unopened bag in the aquarium for 20 minutes or so before beginning the process of adding tankwater to the bag's water. For most fish and most corals, you could gradually add tankwater to the bag until the bag water had doubled in size. Then you should discard half of the water from the bag and repeat that process again before removing the fish or coral from the bag. How slowly you perform that depends on how sensitive you think the animal(s) are and how great the difference is between your tankwater and the bag's water. I always check the salinity of the bag's water before I begin the acclimation procedure and compare that to my tankwater's salinity so that I will have an idea of what I'm up against.

As for iodine, what would you suggest as a good brand to use, and in what proportions should I dose?

There is no reason to dose iodine unless you know that your tankwater is actually low in iodine. It is highly unlikely that your tankwater is below natural seawater iodine levels. In the unlikely event that your total iodine levels are below 0.06 ppm, I suggest you switch test kits first before dosing iodine. Most iodine test kits are virtually useless. SeaChem's iodine test kit, for example, measures only iodide. It does not measure iodate or molecular iodine. None of the test kits measure organic iodine.

I have never added iodine supplements to my aquarium and yet I have never tested iodine levels (using Salifert's iodine test kit, which measures iodide, iodate and molecular iodine) below NSW levels. Usually my tests come in at 0.20 ppm iodide/iodate, which is three times NSW levels. That's perfectly understandable considering the iodine content in the foods we feed our tanks. Iodine content in the various foods we feed: http://web.archive.org/web/200306081...data/foods.asp

In spite of the fact that many "hobby" authors suggest adding iodine supplements on a regular basis, there is no scientific basis for their recommendations. There are no studies showing that anything we keep requires iodine levels in the water column in excess of NSW concentration. There are studies that show that a certain species of shrimp grows optimally when it's diet contains 0.003% iodine. That's an extremely small amount of iodine. Excessive iodine is toxic. That's why it's used in dips to kill pathogens. You don't need to add iodine to your tankwater to "help your shrimp molt." You can bring about premature molting in shrimp by adding too much iodine because iodine is toxic to shrimp just as it's toxic to everything else. They handle this problem by depositing the iodine in their exoskeleton and then shedding the exoskeleton. Some "genius" must have measured the high iodine content in crustacean exoskeletons and declared that that was evidence that crustaceans require elevated iodine levels. By that same logic, I could declare that tuna require high levels of mercury.

Interesting and very informative article on iodine by Dr. Randy Holmes-Farley: http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/mar2003/chem.htm

Here is someone who is recognized as being an extremely successful reef aquarist with more than 20 years experience and he has never added iodine to any of his tanks, including his 718-gal SPS dominated reef, because he says it isn't necessary to add supplemental iodine since the food he feeds contains more than enough iodine to keep his levels above NSW levels: http://www.underseadiscovery.com/home.htm

[apantale]

Thanks Ninong..Very educational for me.. I appreciated that. As for the iodine, I will hold off for sure at this point. I am beginning to think it was an acclimation process, or lack thereof that was the culprit. The salinity in the bag was about 1.028 at 75 degrees, and my tank is at 1.023 at 76 degrees. I also tested for Phosphate this evening and noticed that I was at about .02ppm which is not too high, but not close enough to zero like it should be. Despite this, all of my polyps are doing fine, my plate coral and my gonipora, but the darn green shrooms have seen their last day.

Thanks again