[My2heartboys]

Well, folks, it was bound to happen sooner or later. I've now got pH problems--barely registers at 7.4.:slap: I knew something was off this morning when my only coral, a sarco, was acting strange. It normally responds to the lighting in the room by "waking up" and waving its tentecles around. Well, it was unusually skittish this morning and I puzzled over it while I went and bought a phosphate test, all the while assuming that was the problem. When that turned up a big fat 0-I continued to puzzle it over and wonder what it could be. Then I decided to start by checking my basics, starting with pH. It would barely register on the strip test I had-so I decided to try the pH test somebody had sent me and low and behold it was barely registering at 7.4.

Now I am slowly (and very cautiously) adding some pro-buffer dKH and will be going to the LFS in a bit to have them confirm as well as to get any better suggestion for bringing it up (hopefully very slowly) oh and I will put an ASAP on that kent drip system from Dr. Fosters and Smith.

Gotta go.

Anne

[Reefland]

This is low but I would guess that when the lights came on and an hour or so later the pH started to rise? Since you know what it is in the morning, you should also test in the late evening before the lights go off to determine the swing (due to photosynthesis the pH should be at it's greatest late in the day). Additionally, what is your ALK?

[My2heartboys]

Originally Posted by Reefland

This is low but I would guess that when the lights came on and an hour or so later the pH started to rise? Since you know what it is in the morning, you should also test in the late evening before the lights go off to determine the swing (due to photosynthesis the pH should be at it's greatest late in the day). Additionally, what is your ALK?

__________________________________________________ ___________

No, I don't know what it is after the lights have been out at night--although good idea to check--thank you. The one that I took that was low was after the lights had been on a while (3-4 hours at least).

I will start taking all readings in the morning before the main lights come on and then check them at night after the lights have been on a while and see what the diff is after about a week-it should show a trend. At that time I did not know what my ALK was.

When I went to the LFS and they tested my water with the same test I use at home--it was fine. Not sure what it was but all seems fine now. I think the sarco got skittish because of the 2 clowns fighting over it so I bought some hairy mushrooms in hopes that one would take over that coral.

Will certainly keep an eye on things to see how they go.

Anne

[Poseidon]

Low pH can be prevented by keeping alkalinity levels up. That is why Alk is reffered to as a "buffer", it helps keep pH stable.

[My2heartboys]

Originally Posted by Poseidon

Low pH can be prevented by keeping alkalinity levels up. That is why Alk is reffered to as a "buffer", it helps keep pH stable.

Thank you, will keep an eye on it and start keeping better records. Should be getting my drip system within the next week.

Anne

[Poseidon]

Originally Posted by My2heartboys

Thank you, will keep an eye on it and start keeping better records. Should be getting my drip system within the next week.

Anne

Your Welcome.

Once you get the Ca and Alk stable you should not have any problems with pH unless something MAJOR goes wrong. When I was starting out I had no clue about Ca and Alk and how they played such an important role in our tanks. Heck my LFS didn't even KNOW about alk, much less how important it is. (That one is no longer around.) That leaves 2 in my area....

[My2heartboys]

Originally Posted by Poseidon

Your Welcome.

Once you get the Ca and Alk stable you should not have any problems with pH unless something MAJOR goes wrong. When I was starting out I had no clue about Ca and Alk and how they played such an important role in our tanks. Heck my LFS didn't even KNOW about alk, much less how important it is. (That one is no longer around.) That leaves 2 in my area....

Well, I did the tests this morning. Mind you the living room lights had been on since about 6:00am and I did the tests at 9:45 am. Also the moon lights in the tank had been on all night (they stay on 24/7)

Temp 76.2 F
SG 1.026
pH 8.2
Alk low-med (Red Sea) 180 ppm (Jungle)
Ammonia 0
Nitrite 0-.05ppm
Nitrate 2.5
Phosphate 0
Cal 460 ppm
DKH 12 degrees (1 degree being 17.9ppm KH)

Sorry I haven't gotten these posted sooner and I haven't done the daytime tests yet as I would like to wait until about 8-9pm to do those. Lights came on about 1:30pm and the white light goes out about 10pm and actinic goes off about 10:30pm-11pm. About 10k white lights.

Anne

[My2heartboys]

Originally Posted by Reefland

This is low but I would guess that when the lights came on and an hour or so later the pH started to rise? Since you know what it is in the morning, you should also test in the late evening before the lights go off to determine the swing (due to photosynthesis the pH should be at it's greatest late in the day). Additionally, what is your ALK?

OK, here's the evening tests

Time 7:30pm
Temp 78.4
SG 1.026
pH 8.2
ALK 300ppm
DKH 11 degrees DKH (1 degree being 17.9 ppm KH)
___________________________

Changes

Temp was 76.2
ALK was 180 ppm
DKH was 12 degrees
Date Fri. 10/14 all times are central time zone

[My2heartboys]

Sat 10/15 results

Time: 9:14
SG 1.026 (top of needle there rest below)
pH 7.8
ALK 120-180 (somewhere between not quite either shade of green)
DKH 11 degrees (1 degree=17.9 ppm KH)
Cal 420 ppm

[Reefland]

I think your in fine shape. If I had one suggestion it would be to raise the night time temp to 78 so the daytime hit 80. Does your ALK test provide results in mEq/L?

[My2heartboys]

Originally Posted by Reefland

I think your in fine shape. If I had one suggestion it would be to raise the night time temp to 78 so the daytime hit 80. Does your ALK test provide results in mEq/L?

No, it is in ppm. Measured as dKH to convert to ppm take dKHx17.9=ppm

Does this make sense?

It is an aquarium pharmaceuticals test, if that helps

Anne

[Reefland]

So the dKH is 17.9? That is pretty high??

[My2heartboys]

Originally Posted by Reefland

So the dKH is 17.9? That is pretty high??

The KH would be the product of 11x17.9

Anne

[My2heartboys]

Here's this evenings results

Time 5:16
Temp 78.5
SG 1.026 (Little less than this morning-but not quite .025)
pH 7.8
dKH 10 degrees (179ppm)
Cal 380

Because dKH and Cal had fallen I added 1/2 capful of liquid Cal, Pro-Buffer, and Tech M. All Kent products. I know I will probably need to add more, but due to scheduled engagement this evening was unable to stay and add until corrected all evening and I did not just want to dump a full capful of each in and run. Sorry--I felt adding 1/2 capful at a time is best because of the size of my aquarium.

Anne

[My2heartboys]

Here's todays results

Sun 10/16

Time 11:57
Temp 76.2
SG 1.025-1.026
pH 7.8
dKH 11 degrees (196.9 ppm)
Cal 400

Time 9:57
Temp 78.4
SG 1.025 (bottom of needle at this)
pH 8.2
dKH 12 degrees (214.8ppm)
Cal 400

5 Gallon change out. Changed penguin filter

[ldrhawke]

Originally Posted by My2heartboys

Here's this evenings results

Time 5:16
Temp 78.5
SG 1.026 (Little less than this morning-but not quite .025)
pH 7.8
dKH 10 degrees (179ppm)
Cal 380

Because dKH and Cal had fallen I added 1/2 capful of liquid Cal, Pro-Buffer, and Tech M. All Kent products. I know I will probably need to add more, but due to scheduled engagement this evening was unable to stay and add until corrected all evening and I did not just want to dump a full capful of each in and run. Sorry--I felt adding 1/2 capful at a time is best because of the size of my aquarium.

Anne

You only have a 50 g tank. Stop playing around with additives. It is cheaper, quicker, easier, and less problamatic if you simply do a couple of 25 g water changes over the next week and get your system back in balance, before you start killing off things.

[My2heartboys]

Originally Posted by ldrhawke

You only have a 50 g tank. Stop playing around with additives. It is cheaper, quicker, easier, and less problamatic if you simply do a couple of 25 g water changes over the next week and get your system back in balance, before you start killing off things.

Had to do a wc anyway. My sarco was acting unhappy-so last night I did a 5 gallon changeout and tonight I plan on doing the same. Although the sarco could have been unhappy because of a crab clinging to the underneath of its head and also the urchin was between it and the rock in front of it. That had to be a pretty prickly situation. I am still checking chemistry 2x a day and will hopefully have only one or two more 5 gallon change outs after tonight.

Anne

BTW-sarco was happier for a bit last night before the crab and urchin incident. Had its head completely extended with its tentacles and had its head so that it almost looked like a dryland mushroom! Was really neat to see and what had attracted me to it in the first place.

[ldrhawke]

With only 10% water changes it will take a number of changes to have any real effect on water quality. Small water changes often don't keep up with nutrient build up in some systems. It takes 14 water changes at 10% just to reduce half the nutrients. Even if done once a week they can often build up faster than they are diluted. It is much more effective doing few larger water changes.

See Randy's article...http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2005-10/rhf/index.php

[My2heartboys]

Mon 10/17

Time 10:11am
Temp 77.5
SG 1.025-1.026 (between)
pH 8.0
dKH 12 (214.8ppmKH)
Cal 400


Time 9:27
Temp 78.3
SG 1.025
pH 8.2
dKH 11 (196.9ppm KH)
Cal 400


6 and 1/2 gallon change out and 1/2 capful of liquid calcium.

[ldrhawke]

I referenced Randy's article about water change effectiveness above.

Troy Brightbill wrote an even easier one to understand and read that is in Reefs Org library. http://www.reefs.org/library/article...htbill_wc.html

Small water changes alone, less that 25%, to correct problems are very ineffective to correct high nutrients and totally ineffective at maintaining Ca levels.

It also establishes a case for using a salt mix, like Reef Crystals, that have additonal Ca and trace elements added, to make water changes more effective.

(I'm going to start a new thread with this post becasue I feel it is important to understand)