[sihaya]

Over the past few days I've been trying to understand coral taxonomy... and I'm just about ready to pull my hair out. It's come to the point now that I don't even know what a "coral" is exactly. Here are things that make my head hurt...

1. Subclasses Hexacorallia & Octocorallia... supposedly Octocorals are soft corals while Hexacorals are hard corals. But Zoanthids are hexacorallians, but they're soft and they're anemones. ?!?!

2. Star polyps are actually gorgonians. (I would have never guessed that one...)

3. "Millepora"-- can either be the Anthozoan acropora millepora or the Hydrozoan (fire coral). How confusing is that?!?

4. Pipe organ corals and xenia... I don't even understand what the heck these actually are now.

[sihaya]

Seriously, if zoanthids are "coral" and also "colonial anemones" can someone tell me the actual difference between a soft, non-scleritian coral and an anemone?

[madamekiki]

ugh...now you're making my head hurt...and to think i thought i was starting to understand it all...darn you, now i have to go back and reread the coral book at work.

rachel

[Poseidon]

Don't forget about the Octocoral that is a HARD CORAL....Heliopora Coerulea

[sihaya]

Originally Posted by Poseidon

Don't forget about the Octocoral that is a HARD CORAL....Heliopora Coerulea

Yeah, isn't that the "pipe organ" coral?

[Poseidon]

Nope, it is Blue ridge coral. You know the one that is brown, until you kill it, bleach it, and sell it for tourists for its pretty baby blue color.

[Poseidon]

To add a couple more misfits to your list...

Alveopora and Goniopora (sp?) Both are "flowerpots" and have very similar forms, except the number of feeding tenticles...

[sihaya]

Originally Posted by Poseidon

Nope, it is Blue ridge coral. You know the one that is brown, until you kill it, bleach it, and sell it for tourists for its pretty baby blue color.

Wait, are you sure? I thought blue ridge was a Hydrozoan...

[Ninong]

Originally Posted by sihaya

supposedly Octocorals are soft corals while Hexacorals are hard corals. But Zoanthids are hexacorallians, but they're soft and they're anemones. ?!?!

Not all Hexacorallians are hard corals. The Scleractinia are just one of seven orders of Hexacorallians: Actiniaria, Antipatharia, Ceriantharia, Corallimorpharia, Ptychodactiaria, Scleractinia, and Zoanthidea.

There are six orders of Octocorallians: Telestacea, Alcyonacea, Stolonifera, Gorgonacea, Pennatulacea and Helioporacea.

[Ninong]

Originally Posted by sihaya

Yeah, isn't that the "pipe organ" coral?

Pipe organ corals are in the order Stolonifera. Blue coral is in the genus Heliopora, which is the only genus in the order Helioporacea according to U.C. Berkeley's taxonomy.

However, this taxonomy for Anthozoa lists two families in Helioporacea.

[Ninong]

Originally Posted by Poseidon

Nope, it is Blue ridge coral. You know the one that is brown, until you kill it, bleach it, and sell it for tourists for its pretty baby blue color.

What are you talking about?

The skeletons of Heliopora are blue. I have seen a picture of one growing on the side glass of an aquarium and it's skeleton is blue.

P.S. -- Never mind. I must have misread your post. I now think I see that you agree that the skeletons are blue once the tissue has been removed.

[Ninong]

Originally Posted by Poseidon

To add a couple more misfits to your list...

Alveopora and Goniopora (sp?) Both are "flowerpots" and have very similar forms, except the number of feeding tenticles...

That's why common names are ridiculous and shouldn't be used. They're also called daisy corals and probably a whole bunch of other names, too.

[Ninong]

Originally Posted by sihaya

Seriously, if zoanthids are "coral" and also "colonial anemones" can someone tell me the actual difference between a soft, non-scleritian coral and an anemone?

First of all, an anemone is a flower that grows from a bulb. I used to plant them. In fact, Anemone is the Latin genus name for this flower.



The anemones you're thinking about were all named after the flower, not the other way around.

The word "anemone" when used in the reefkeeping hobby is simply a common name that is applied to a lot of different animals from more than one order.

The Actiniaria are sea anemones in the strict sense of the word. However, the Corallimorpharia are called anemones, the Ptychodactinaria are called anemones and, last but not least, the Zoanthidea are called anemones. Isn't that nice?

Each animal has only one scientific name but it can have more than one common name -- even dozens of different common names for the same animal. And, in the case of "anemones," we have four entire orders that are referred to as "anemones."

[sihaya]

Thanks, but my head still hurts...

[Poseidon]

Mine too! I guess it is easier to sit back and enjoy, then it is to try and name everything.

I tried to use latin names for fish for a while, but I found no one else knew what I was talking about.

[kevinpo]

Each animal has only one scientific name but it can have more than one common name -- even dozens of different common names for the same animal.

While it's true the species names are fairly fixed the Genus classification of both corals and fish can be rather fluid. Sometimes even the Suborder and Family can change. It used to be if you had reference books older than 20 years you would run into trouble with names. Now 2-3 years and they are out of date let alone all the new additions they will be arguing about for the next 20 years The estimate for corals is about 2,000+ as of yet unnamed ones
Because Latin is used to scientifically name corals they can be difficult to pronounce and remember, so simple common names are exchanged for them that are often representative of how they look. Latin often does this too but since we don't know Latin we don't have memory by association which can be a useful tool for remembering.
I'm thankful we just type here so you can't hear me butcher many of the Latin words.

Regards,
Kevin

[Ninong]

It's true that the taxonomy of marine animals is constantly being revised but there is only one valid scientific name at any given moment in time. As you say, sometimes the classification is in dispute and it can be difficult to keep up sometimes, but you can usually identify something if you know either its current valid name or any of its previous names. This holds true even when the genus or family has been changed.

The scientific community doesn't pronounce Latin the same as a Latin scholar would. Here is a guide to pronunciation of scientific names. Even people who study Latin, don't all pronounce it the same. I took Latin for four years in high school but I pronounce it the way it was pronounced in the Middle Ages, not the way it was pronounced in Caesar's time. In other words, my pronunciation of Latin is closer to Italian than classical pronunciation. Just follow the link if you want to figure out what I'm saying.

The nice thing about the Latin and Greek scientific names is that they are often descriptive and tell you exactly what you're looking at. Virtually all Latin words are found in English and many Greek words, too. Latin forms the foundation for most European languages, even English, although it is less obvious than in French, Spanish or Italian.

[Ninong]

Just look at the word "aquarium" for starters. "Aqua" is water and the "ium" suffix indicates a place. So an aquarium is a place for keeping water.

A refugium is a place for refuge. Fugere = to flee, and the "ium" suffix indicates that a refugium is a place to flee back to because the "Re" prefix indicates going back. Return, rebate, etc.

Siganus unimaculatus means it has one spot. The "uni" prefix indicates one and the "maculatus" means spot. Immaculate means without spots. The "im" prefix is a negative, just as the "in" prefix is, or the "non" prefix, etc.

My guess is that more than half of English words have Latin roots.

[Ninong]

A hexacoral has six tentacles. An octocoral has eight tentacles, etc. Think hexagon and octagon.

Also, biped, quadriped, tripod, etc. The bi means two, the quad means four, the tri means three. Ped or pod means feed. An octopus has eight legs (really arms) but the reason the plural is octopuses and not octopi is because octopus comes from the Greek, not the Latin.

[tray262]

This is worse then Music theroy.