[smidoid]

I'm just floating an idea - if you'll pardon the cliche.

With the introduction of better chemical filtering sytems and (if the hype is to be believed, the PolyFilter as an example works so well) I can't help wondering if the "Berlin" method is ready for the scrapheap. If Polyfilter is as a good as is claimed, then it seems to my basic experience that a working system is feasible sans skimmer & LR. More room for the things we really want.

Obviously, no one is going to give up Berlin right away, but if these filters are so effective at removing Ammonia and Nitrite at source (so to speak) isn't it therefore possible (and perhaps even desirable) to have a tank which contains just livestock? Presumably whatever little Nitrate that was produced could be controlled by infrequent partial water changes.

I don't want to start a flame war here, so I should explain that by livestock I mean all marnine life for a given biotope, not just the fish.

Course, perhaps Polyfilter isn't that good. But does anyone else think this is a good grounding for a properly controlled experiment?

For example, presumably there would need to be a certain amount of nitrifying bacteria (nitrosomas/nitrobacters) present to handle whatever the chemical mop doesn't catch.

To reiterate, I'm only floating an idea. I don't have the resources to test it - if I did, I would be!

[weez1959]

Hi Marc,
Putting the benefits (IMO) of liverock aside, wouldn't a tank with just livestock be kinda... for lack of a better word, blah? I also think the fish would not feel as "at home" without the rock. I know my fish almost all pick a nook for the night so I think without ample hiding places, I think it would contribute to stressed fish,
Anyone else think this?
Even if these filter do work great, rock adds beauty to the tank and of course looks more natural, so maybe using both would be better!

[smidoid]

There'll always be room for a natural hiding place for the fish to roost, yeah. So LR is a benefit there. I have a bit of a downer on it because all of mine is such ugly stuff and I see it as functional. By doing away with that, we could use pre-made stuff using Argocrete (as a for instance) that could look nicer.

[weez1959]

depends on how ugly your rock is Got a pic? Can't be that bad
Maybe use what you have as a base and add a few nice ones!
I know that on Geothermal Aquaculture Research Foundation Home Page they show you how to make your own rock but that's in no way live rock. Of course it does become live rock to a degree eventually.

[Reefland]

I don't think there will ever be a good substitue for Liverock. Are there other methods that will work? Sure, and I am sure that more will be developed. However the liverock is natural, and effective at adding filtration capacity with the life found on/within it. Secondly, the liverock works best for the reef structure formation. With those two keys, I see no reason to ever run a tank without it.

[Clay12340]

The only thing I could see happening with live rock is that if the polyfilters do work as well as claimed people might buy less actual live rock and more base rock. Without the rock you couldn't really have a reef. You'd just have a frag tank with bigger frags