I Could Really Use Some Help

[Llewellyn]

I hope you all can help me. Friday I picked up a free 40 gal acrylic saltwater setup from a person on freecycle. When I went to pick it up, I wasn't expecting a live tank, I thought it would just be equipment, so I was TOTALLY unprepared. I was expecting to have time to do some research, etc, before getting it up and running. The tank had three leather corals in it, the tank was beautiful and obviously well cared for. I do have experience with freshwater, I raised discus for a few years, so I'm not completely unfamiliar with how some of this all works, but NO saltwater experience at all.

Now for my problems, lol. When we moved the tank, we drained approximately 3/4 of the water. I got it home, up and running in less than an hour. I refilled the tank with water the guy I got it from had prepared ahead of time and let me take with me. The first two days I tested the water and it was pretty much perfect. 0 ammonia, nitrates, nitrites, pH 8.2, hydrometer reading 1.021. The corals seemed fine despite the move.

For the last two days my readings have been:

Ammonia 0.25
Nitrate 2.5
NITRITE 0.1
Ph 8.2
Hydrometer reading 1.021

And now as of this afternoon, I have brown algae that's moving in fast. The tank is apparently cycling, and don't know if I should just let it go or what? If I do water changes, won't it just take longer to cycle? I did 20 percent water changes the last two days since there are live corals in there in the hopes of saving them. I've read and read and read until my brain is ready to explode, lol, and I'm just as confused as when I started. I posted on another forum but am not getting too much back as far as info so far. One person did suggest I keep on doing the water changes, but I don't know if it's the right thing to do.

The setup has metal halide & LED lighting (blue and white). It's a sump type filtration system, intake in one chamber, filter material, then a chamber full of bioballs, another chamber with the powerhead (I think) and a bag full of small rocks and what looks like might be carbon chips. I've been using Red Sea salt for the water changes (came with the setup, I assume that's what he'd been using).

Any help/advice is appreciated. I'm really hoping to be able to save the leathers, if at all possible, if it's not too late already. They look fine, but I know that can be deceiving.

I was going to post pics of the setup to help with any diagnosis, but of course photobucket is down right now. I'll post them as soon as possible, if it would help.

THANK YOU!

Kim

[Parrothead]

Let it be, you are going to have a mini cycle due to the fact you tore it down and reset it up, the brown alg. will go away on its own, continue to test water, and if it gets really out of hand, then change some out. after you cycle slowly start removing the bio balls, don't know how big the wet dry is, but if you have live sand and rock you will not be needing the bio-balls, but let the tank settle then slowly start removing them. Be patient, you've kept discus, not an easy fish to keep, so you definitely got a start as to what you are doing, listen to the people here, they are knowledgable and very helpful. Happy Reefing

Tanks,
Robert

[zhenya]

Hi Kim,



Like Robert said already, slow down just a bit with the water changes.
First thing that jumps at me in your water parameters is your salinity(specific gravity) reading. 1.021 is too low for even a fish only marine aquarium. Reef aquarium salinity should be 35ppt or 1.026 specific gravity. Your hydrometer could be giving you wrong reading as they are not exactly very acurate. If you can double check your measurements with calibrated refractometer it would be much better. Try raising your salinity slowly in the next couple of weeks.
Here's an article discussing reef's temperatures and salinity levels.
Reef Stability, A Moving Target by Ronald L. Shimek, Ph.D. - Reef Hobbyist Online Magazine

It would have been better if you used the old water that you removed from the tank, set it up and let it run for a week and then do a 20% exchange. But, it doesn't matter now. ;)

[Llewellyn]

Thanks everyone. I sort of suspected I shouldn't be doing the water changes. Robert, you suggested removing the bioballs. . .do I replace them with something? A salesperson at my local fish store suggested that also, and said to replace them slowly with live rock. Is that right? Also, I've read if I have some foam on the top of the water (as you can see I do) that I need a protein skimmer. It's only a 40, what do you suggest?

Photobucket is back up, so here's what I have.

[gregr]

You got all that for free?! Lucky you- that is cool beans.
Yes to the protien skimmer. I don't see a picture of the sump though- is there one inside the stand? If no sump then you'll want to look at hang-on-the-back skimmers.
Adding liverock in place of the bioballs would be good, but you want to add cured rock if you can find it. Adding uncured will contribute to the mini-cycle the tank is going thru now.

[Llewellyn]

Thanks gregr. I know, I couldn't believe it either when I got there. I was expecting a tank with some misc equipment, but got there to a full running tank! Plus the guy probably gave me $200 worth of MH's that aren't even open yet, a testing set that looks like it's been used once or twice, equipment to clean the tank, a practically full barrel of Red Sea salt, several different kinds of sw fish and invert foods, 1/2 gal of stress coat, and a huge box of dead corals for decoration. UNBELIEVABLE! He said he recently got rid of a larger tank, and hung onto this one for old time's sake. . .but just didn't have time for it and wanted someone to enjoy it. I definitely lucked out. Plus, it was the first thing I'd ever actually requested on freecycle. I usually use it to get rid of my kids' old clothes, lol. Awesome reef you've got there, btw. Beautiful!

[gregr]

Thanks
It's great to see someone be so generous.
Not sure what you're using for source water (to replace evaporated water [top=off] and for water changes) but if it's tap water you will want to consider getting an ro/di filter under your sink. Since you already have a couple corals, and you have that metal halide lighting you'll probably add more... did anyone mention to you that this hobby is totally addictive? Anyhow- with corals you want/need to keep the water as clean as possible and tap water... not so clean.

[Llewellyn]

I've been using RO for water changes. The corals aren't looking to happy this morning, BTW. I just tested the water and it is holding at the same levels that I posted above. What should I expect from a "mini cycle"? I know how a cycle goes on a brand new tank, but should I just expect less of a spike/drop pattern than normal? Will it last as long as a regular cycle?

Addicting? Yes! Despite the bumpy start, it definitely leaves you craving more! Been to the LFS almost everyday since, lol.

[Lucid]

Great find there, and really awesome someone gave it away to you. Looks like your sump is built into the tank? I cannot tell, but is there live rock in the display or is that dead corals + live corals?

Oh, and about your salinity/specific gravity, I would buy a refractometer first before raising the SG up any. Your current hydrometer could be wrong or right and only a refractometer will let you know for sure.

[Llewellyn]

Hi,

Yes, I believe that's the setup, built into the back of the tank. From everything I've been reading and the advice I've received on here, looks like a refractometer needs to be my first purchase.

Most of the stuff in the tank is dead/decorative coral. There are three live leathers. One small live rock.

ALSO, lol, I noticed something something crawling out of one of the dead decorative corals, looks like a worm. Probably not happy about the conditions right now. It's not coming all the way out, but from what I can see it's about 1/8 to 1/4" around, reddish orange with a black stripe (vertical, I think, not rings). Any ideas on what it is? I read the worm articles on here and didn't see anything that looked similar. Can't really tell how big it is, as it didn't come all the way out, but definitely could tell it was alive.

Thanks!
K

[Seige]

from RC's FAQ... "Why are bio balls bad?"
Bio balls are exceptionally good at converting ammonia to nitrite and nitrite to nitrate, but their effectiveness stops there. If they are your main source of filtration, nitrates will probably accumulate in your tank, causing algae growth and other problems, like reduced stony coral growth, and eventually (if they get high enough) stress in marine fish. If you have bio balls in your system now, your best option is to slowly remove them over a period of a few weeks in order to give the rest of your system a chance to develop natural mechanisms of nutrient export. Do NOT remove them all at once!

I'd wait until your cyclings done before removing them. They should be helping the cycling process for now. If your nitrates start going way up you can start removing the balls a few every few days.

[Seige]

You really got lucky with all that free stuff. I've spent around $3,700 for my 55g setup and I still need more equipment. Thankfully not a lot more livestock.

You should send him a note in a month or so telling how it's going with a pic. I'm sure he'll like to hear it's going well.

[Lucid]

Hi,

Yes, I believe that's the setup, built into the back of the tank. From everything I've been reading and the advice I've received on here, looks like a refractometer needs to be my first purchase.

Most of the stuff in the tank is dead/decorative coral. There are three live leathers. One small live rock.

ALSO, lol, I noticed something something crawling out of one of the dead decorative corals, looks like a worm. Probably not happy about the conditions right now. It's not coming all the way out, but from what I can see it's about 1/8 to 1/4" around, reddish orange with a black stripe (vertical, I think, not rings). Any ideas on what it is? I read the worm articles on here and didn't see anything that looked similar. Can't really tell how big it is, as it didn't come all the way out, but definitely could tell it was alive.

Thanks!
K

Don't remove the bioballs just yet. You will need to get some (cured) live rock in there before that. You could buy uncured live rock online and then cure it yourself in a separate container, that might save some cash.

That worm sounds like a bristol worm, a good guy usually. Does it have white looking fine hairs (bristols) on it? If so then likely that is it. A good pic would help to tell for sure, I think there are many different ones.

[Llewellyn]

I looked it up and you're right, thanks! It is a Bristol. I'm going to take your all's advice and just let it run as is for a while and see what happens. The algae has really bloomed today, boy is it ugly, lol. Should I run the lights a little less to try to combat it at the risk of stressing out the already VERY stressed leathers?

[Ramer]

Either first or second get a skimmer. I have a Remora on my 90 and very happy with it. Yes to the refractometer as well I started out using a plastic Hydrometer and it was way off.
Congrats on the new Toy

[gregr]

I think shortening the photo period is a good idea. How long are the lights on now?

[Llewellyn]

I had LEDs (blue) coming on for about an hour a.m., then the MH for about 13 hours, then back to LED again. I'm not real up on the lighting thing yet, but figured I should maybe cut it back due to the algae. What do you think?

[gregr]

Sounds like you could definitely cut back on that. Probably by a few hours for the metal halides. Don't do it all at once though. I think most people run their mh lights for 8-10 hours but that's just a rough guess.

[Seige]

If your simulating real life conditions at the equator, you should run your lights for 12 hours.

1 hour of actinics (simulating dawn); followed by
10 hours of actinics and daylights; followed by
1 hour of actinics (simulating dusk)

Eventually, you can also get into lunar lighting including modules that simulate the moon's lunar cycle around the earth. That's pretty extreme though, usually done to help with spawning.

Finally, if you want to view at night get a red light or red filter. I use a red light bulb in a normal lamp. It doesn't scare the critters that come out after dark. Not that I have many yet. ;-)

[Llewellyn]

Thanks Seige!

Water readings today are confusing me a little here.

PREVIOUS readings of the last three days were:

Ammonia 0.25
Nitrate 2.5
NITRITE 0.1
Ph 8.2

TODAY'S readings are:

Ammonia 0
Nitrate - (here's where I need help) the reading isn't on the chart. You know how it goes from a greenish color to purples, then pinks, then red for high on the chart? It's light blue! Nothing even similar on my chart. I tested twice to make sure I didn't make a mistake, got the same result.

Nitrites 0
pH went up to 8.4

Tested the Alkalinity which has been in the normal range and it went up to the lower side of high.

I was really excited when I got the 0 ammonia and nitrite readings, then did nitrates and confusion set in, lol.

Brown algae looks about the same as it did yesterday. It went nuts for about 48 hours but growth seems to have slowed way down.

Any ideas?

Kim