[SPasse]

Hi All,

Here is a letter that I sent to Dr. Susan Williams, one of the advisors to this bill:

Dr. Susan Williams, Ph.D
Bodega Marine Laboratory
P.O. Box 247
Bodega Bay, CA 94923
(707) 875-2211
(707) 875-2009 fax
email: slwilliams@ucdavis.edu

Dear Susan,

This letter is to express my opposition to California Bill AB 1334 as it is currently written.

I have been following the environmental devastation that the non-native species, Caulerpa Taxifolia has been causing in the Mediterranean and off of the coast of California.

I have not objection to the banning of the specific Caulerpa species, Caulerpa Taxifolia.

But the blanket of the entire Genus of Caulerpa, would devastate the marine aquarium hobby and trade. This is because various other species of Caulerpa are almost always present in a marine aquarium.

I am also unaware of any of the other species of the marine algae caulerpa, causing similar problems as is Caulerpa taxifolia.

I therefore urge you to consider asking that this bill be amended to be limited in scope to specifically target Caulerpa taxifolia.

Thank you for your time and consideration.

Regards,

Scott D Passe

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The definition of an expert is a washed-up drip under pressure.
You can see my reeftank at http://www.homestead.com/spasse/

[Ninong]

SPASSE ~

I just got through visiting the Calif. Assembly site and reading through the history of AB 1334 and the two committee votes. This bill is going to pass, there is no question about it. The committee vote on the amended version was 21-0. And yes, it would ban live rock that had any Caulerpa spp. attached. And yes, they have considered the impact on the aquarium industry in California. I don't know if they are concerned about the fact that it would put all the live rock importers in Los Angeles out of business or not but my guess is that they're probably not concerned.

From their impact analysis:
3)Impact to Aquarium Industry . The prohibition on transactions
involving all Caulerpa species proposed by the bill would shut
off a segment of the aquarium hobby market in California.
There are several species of Caulerpa that are sold in
aquarium and pet shops to people who keep salt water
aquariums, as food for herbivorous fish, as habitat for other
organisms, as decoration, and as a form of natural filtration.
While importation of CT into the United State is banned under
the Noxious Weed Act of 1999, its sale and possession is still
legal.

They were advised by their scientific advisors that it would be impossible for the people charged with enforcement to differentiate between the various species of Caulerpa and that is why they intend to ban the entire genus because of problems with C. taxifolia.

It's kinda like shooting all the toy poodles in the neighborhood because a stray pit bull attacked your kid.

Ninong [img]/ubb/smile.gif[/img]

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Irrational Exuberance!

[SPasse]

LOOKS LIKE THE END IS NEAR!

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The definition of an expert is a washed-up drip under pressure.
You can see my reeftank at http://www.homestead.com/spasse/

[Ninong]

Maybe they could have Caulerpa Clubs and you could get it as long as you had a note from your doctor. [img]/ubb/biggrin.gif[/img] Kinda like all the Cannabis Clubs. Hey, maybe the Cannabis Clubs could just open a new section called: sea weed.

How come mota no es problemo but caulerpa is? [img]/ubb/tongue.gif[/img]

I wonder how they determine your fine:
2)Subjects violators to a fine ranging from $500 to $10,000 per violation.

I guess if you import several hundred pounds of live rock that has any Caulerpa spp. on it, you get hit with the $10,000 fine for intent to distribute. Maybe if they discover just a few ounces in your tank, it would be only $500 for personal use.

This bill even bans possession. They are not just talking about new imports. No possession, no transfer, no trade, no import, no anything that has any species of Caulerpa. So of course it would block the importation, or sale, of live rock in California if there was any possibility that it might harbor any Caulerpa.

Ninong [img]/ubb/smile.gif[/img]


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Irrational Exuberance!

[waterboy]

What about the east coast/gulf and Hawaii? How will they be affected?

[Coraltank]

IMHO,the most disturbing part of this arguement envolves.."They were advised by their scientific advisors that it would be impossible for the people charged with
enforcement to differentiate between the various species of Caulerpa ".How can scientific advisors recommend such a blanket approach.It stands as a most unscientific solution to a problem.Impossible?Then how can hobbiest(non-scientist)know the difference like we do?The whole bill is a sham.I guess next it will be to difficult to decide who the speeders are and just give everyone a ticket.

[SPasse]

Coraltank,

I would be fun to got to the public hearing for this bill and hold up a picture of say, Caulerpa racemosa and a picture of Caulerpa Taxifolia and say something to the effect. Excuse me but are you trying to tell me your state inspectors are too stupid to tell the difference between these two plants.

God, I am sure glad these people are not looking for marijuana in my back yard and find my parsley!

Give me a break, this is just a bald face excuse (lie) to ban all “non native” marine plants.

Regards,

Scott

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The definition of an expert is a washed-up drip under pressure.
You can see my reeftank at http://www.homestead.com/spasse/

[Ninong]

Originally posted by waterboy:
What about the east coast/gulf and Hawaii? How will they be affected?

Waterboy ~

This is a bill that is being proposed in the State of California, Assembly Bill 1334, and would be a new California law if passed by both the assembly and the senate, and signed by Gov. Grey Davis. The only effect on other states (at the moment) if it is enacted into law, would be to prohibit interstate commerce between California and any other state that involved the wicked weed Caulerpa in any form.

A side effect might be to cause collectors like Walt Smith International to send their live rock to a different state for distribution, or quite possibly, to scrub all the wicked caulerpa off the live rock to satisfy the Caulerpa Police.

Naturally, there is always the possibility that other states, particularly Texas and Florida, might adopt similar laws.

Ninong [img]/ubb/smile.gif[/img]



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Irrational Exuberance!

[Ninong]

Here is the official rationale:

1)Rationale . The measure's sponsor, the Resources Agency, is
concerned about the potential for the rapid spread of CT off
the southern California coast if the alga should become
established someday. Because of the potential for marine
ecological and economic damage resulting from a CT invasion
and the difficulty in differentiating between several Caulerpa species to identify CT, the author proposes to prohibit various transactions involving all Caulerpa algae species.

Here is the link to comment on an assembly bill. Just enter the bill number 1334 and then click Search.
http://www.assembly.ca.gov/acs/acsframeset2text.htm
After you get to that bill, if you want to comment on it, just click Comment at the top. I'm sure it would help if you lived in California.

Ninong [img]/ubb/smile.gif[/img]

P.S. - Harman introduced the bill, but Carole Migden is Chairwoman of the Committee on Appropriations that is handling the bill. This was the vote on the amended version in case you see the name of your local assemblyman. Carole Migden, of course, is from San Francisco.

VOTES - ROLL CALL
MEASURE: AB 1334
AUTHOR: Harman
TOPIC: Genus Caulerpa.
DATE: 04/25/2001
LOCATION: ASM. APPR.
MOTION: Do pass as amended.
(AYES 21. NOES 0.) (PASS)


AYES
****

Migden Bates Alquist Aroner
Ashburn Cedillo Corbett Correa
Daucher Goldberg Maldonado Robert Pacheco
Papan Pavley Runner Simitian
Thomson Wesson Wiggins Wright
Zettel


NOES
****

ABSENT, ABSTAINING, OR NOT VOTING



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Irrational Exuberance!

[InsaneCaine]

Originally posted by waterboy:
What about the east coast/gulf and Hawaii? How will they be affected?

It will be harder to get Pacific live rock even if you're not in California. Since almost all, if not all, Pacific live rock goes through LAX, they will have to have it shipped to another state. Therefore it will make it more expensive to be shipped. If this happens, many more people may buy gulf rock, therefore increasing the demand and inflating an already high price for gulf rock. This is my view on the consequences anyway. Is this how you guys see it?

Ninong, we must have been replying to waterboy's post at the same time. [img]/ubb/biggrin.gif[/img]


[This message has been edited by InsaneCaine (edited 05-02-2001).]

[Ninong]

Here is the link to the entire committee that is handling the Caulerpa bill, AB 1334. It contains names, phone numbers and e-mail links:
http://www.assembly.ca.gov/acs/newco...p?committee=43

Ninong [img]/ubb/tongue.gif[/img]

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Irrational Exuberance!

[Ninong]

Of course, here is the real problem right here (their "scientific advisor"):

Dr. Susan Williams, Ph.D
Bodega Marine Laboratory
P.O. Box 247
Bodega Bay, CA 94923
(707) 875-2211
(707) 875-2009 fax
email: slwilliams@ucdavis.edu

Maybe someone should raise this issue with Rob Toonen. He probably knows her personally since they both work for UC Davis. Or everybody in the Bay Area could drive up to Bodega Bay to protest.

Ninong [img]/ubb/tongue.gif[/img]

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Irrational Exuberance!

[SPasse]

Ninong,

Just sent an E-mail to Rob.

Regards,

Scott

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The definition of an expert is a washed-up drip under pressure.
You can see my reeftank at http://www.homestead.com/spasse/

[ranaman]

NOW WAIT A FOGGY BLUE EYED MORNING! They are afraid that the Med's Caulerpa is going to invade Florida???? On the TV on SCIENTIFIC AMERICAN FRONTIERS they had researchers collecting sap sucking slugs from the Banana River, off the space center, to get cold tolerant bio-controls for the Med's problem. The problem is partly the cane toad syndrome, check for unforseen problems with a bio control before release and the fact that since the problem started with the goverment. IF we don't say anything the problem might go away.
I understand CA is using this latter policy for Imported Fire Ant eradication. Don't underestimate the power of CA wildlife enforcement. I talked to a LFS owner who knew someone that supplied killie fish eggs for a space shuttle mission. His eggs almost didn't fly since someone forgot to get a CA permit for some Tilapia eggs that where in the same experiment package. I can see it now, "I don't care if you are an astronuat landing on a desert dry lake bed, you illegally imported tilapia into the state of California, I'm going to sieze your vehicle!"

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"The octopus notices the little cowries."

[Ninong]

Originally posted by ranaman:
NOW WAIT A FOGGY BLUE EYED MORNING! They are afraid that the Med's Caulerpa is going to invade Florida????

No, Waterboy asked how that bill would affect the east coast or Hawaii and I was just explaining to him that it is strictly a California state law but that something like that might be enacted in states such as Texas or Florida. After all, if Caulerpa taxifolia can be a problem off the coast of San Diego, it can certainly be a problem off the coast of Corpus Christi or Miami Beach.

Ninong [img]/ubb/smile.gif[/img]

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Irrational Exuberance!

[ranaman]

I wasn't talking about the CA proposed law but olgakurts article that states that Florida is in danger from a species that already is a native here. The California law can have bad effects for the rest of us if it effects transportation.
Of course it could be like the "Golden Orfe" story. You can not own golden orfes in CA. Somebody wanted some in FL and the transhipper in CA had them listed by their scientific name Leuciscus idus. So I asked the salesman if they were the gold morph, to which he answered with a laugh yes they were.

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"The octopus notices the little cowries."

[SPasse]

Hi All,

I have been corresponding with one of the Biologists (Dr. Susan Williams, Ph.D) that was an advisor to this bill.

And, from the hobbyist perspective, a darker picture is emerging.

It seems that:

1 Other species of macro algae have been identified as “invasive” including Caulerpa racemosa (Grape).

2 There have been peer reviewed studies that have shown that the Caulerpa taxifolia that is causing the problems is a mutated variety that arose in aquariums (DNA evidence) There is a fear that other species either already have or will mutate in a similar fashion.

3 Because of the morphology of Caulerpa in general, it really is beyond the means of inspectors to unequivocally separate Caulerpa taxifolia form other species.

Beyond the implications for those of use that use caulerpa as a filter, of course there is the live rock issue, as I and others have pointed out caulerpa among live rock is almost universal. Also, most of the pacific live rock that comes into the country does so through California.

On the enforcement issue, well this whole “killer algae” issue seems to be a really “big deal” with environmentalists right now, so… And also, for environmental law, California tends to be a trendsetter in this area.

I will post the responses from the biologists that I am corresponding with, as soon as I get permission to do so.

Regards,

Scott

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The definition of an expert is a washed-up drip under pressure.
You can see my reeftank at http://www.homestead.com/spasse/

[waterboy]

Scott,
Just sent Harman an email similar to the sample letter that you link to on your website. Some key points in my letter:
Your bill's proponents argue that all of the species should be banned because they look alike, cannot be easily distinguished and possess similar DNA structure. This is simply not true. In the spirit of this trend, maybe you should ban Parsley because it looks similar to Marijuana, or the hunting of ducks because they look like eagles. Also, what constitues "similar DNA structure"? Humans have "similar" DNA structure to frogs, but do you consider them equal?
What do you think?
Brian

[SPasse]

Waterboy,

Well, I am trying not to get discouraged about this but it is obvious that the technical advisors on this bill consider all species of caulerpa to be invasive or potentially so. And as I have said above, this argument could be used against everything from guppies to cats & dogs.

But I have even been visiting the LFS’ who are busy handing the letters from Pet Industry Joint Advisory Council.

Regards,

Scott

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The definition of an expert is a washed-up drip under pressure.
You can see my reeftank at http://www.homestead.com/spasse/

[Nanook01]

Spasse,

Just a small correction on the website that you posted for people like me who are writing a letter to Assemblyman Harman. In the sample letter it starts saying "I have been following your AB 1336 related to....". This should be 1334 I think. I noticed it as I was writing my letter, it would look better if we had the right number in our letter. Not sure if it's a biggie, just thought I would mention it, if several people typed 1336, it might look kind of goofy.

Nanook