Skunk cleaner shrimp and peppermint together?

[ToddTT]

I bought two skunk cleaner shrimp today for my 75 gallon FOWLR tank. I don't normally have inverts, but these guys are cool! And I was looking for a little help with uneaten food and detritus.

So tonight I'm surfing, and find somebody claiming to have peppermint shrimp that are eating hydroids in their tank. Which I unfortunately have.

And another claiming to have a Coral Beauty doing the same.

So I'm wondering if people here have multiple types of shrimp in their tanks, and how they are getting along.

In my case, I have two skunk cleaner shrimp... and would go for an additional three peppermint (three is recommended in a couple of places I have looked).

Does that sound like a good or bad plan?

And if I go for a Coral Beauty, or Black Nox Angel, how reef-unfriendly have people found these angels?

[twisted]

I bought two skunk cleaner shrimp today for my 75 gallon FOWLR tank. I don't normally have inverts, but these guys are cool! And I was looking for a little help with uneaten food and detritus.

So tonight I'm surfing, and find somebody claiming to have peppermint shrimp that are eating hydroids in their tank. Which I unfortunately have.

And another claiming to have a Coral Beauty doing the same.

So I'm wondering if people here have multiple types of shrimp in their tanks, and how they are getting along.

In my case, I have two skunk cleaner shrimp... and would go for an additional three peppermint (three is recommended in a couple of places I have looked).

Does that sound like a good or bad plan?

And if I go for a Coral Beauty, or Black Nox Angel, how reef-unfriendly have people found these angels?

ive had a coral beauty for almost a year now and dont haave too much trouble with it. when i started adding acros i found it picked at them and also when i added a frogspawn. but i believe it was cleaning them. i have seen it eat hydroids that came on a piece of lr i got and havent seen any in a long time. i see tanks with both flavors of shrimp in them but dont have any personal xp with them because i cant keep cleaners in my tank for some reason.

[Steve McKay]

I guess were going to find out. I have a cleaner shrimp and I'm going to the LFS today to get Peppermint shrimp to eat my aiptasia. The one thing I do know about Peppermint shrimp they will pick at Coco worms and feather dusters, cleaner shrimp won't. My Coco worm even lets my cleaner walk on it without withdrawing into it's tube.

[ToddTT]

I guess were going to find out. I have a cleaner shrimp and I'm going to the LFS today to get Peppermint shrimp to eat my aiptasia. The one thing I do know about Peppermint shrimp they will pick at Coco worms and feather dusters, cleaner shrimp won't. My Coco worm even lets my cleaner walk on it without withdrawing into it's tube.

Perfect! Please let me know how you make out.

Will you be getting one or several? Seems they are social and do best in groups of three or more, according to some sources.

Good luck!

[Steve McKay]

Perfect! Please let me know how you make out.

Will you be getting one or several? Seems they are social and do best in groups of three or more, according to some sources.

Good luck!

They say they are social and get along with other aquarium inhabitants. I have never read that they need to be in a group. I believe that "they" say that so you will buy more. I don't know how many I'll get, when I called the LFS last night they only had three. But if I buy all three I'll get a discount and they will only be $24.

[Ninong]

The shrimp commonly known as the "skunk cleaner shrimp" in the hobby is Lysmata amboinensis from the Indo-Pacific. The shrimp commonly known as the "peppermint shrimp" in the hobby is Lysmata wurdemanni from the Caribbean. Both are cleaner shrimp. They will get along well together in the same aquarium but you should not overload the aquarium with too many shrimp. All cleaner shrimp are territorial. The size of their natural territory varies with species but for these two species I would suggest not exceeding one shrimp per linear foot of tank size: 3' tank = 3 shrimp, 4' tank = 4 shrimp, etc.

Most of the skunk cleaner shrimp and peppermint shrimp entering the U.S. hobby market are captive-bred, so you shouldn't have to worry about ending up with Lysmata rathbunae being sold as a "peppermint shrimp." Both L. rathbunae and L. wurdemanni are peppermint shrimp but L. rathbunae doesn't eat Aiptasia. These two are rather difficult to tell apart.

L. amboinensis has a look-alike species, too: L. grabhami. It's easy to tell those two apart by the tail markings. L. amboinensis is from the Indo-Pacific region and L. grabhami is from the Caribbean. It's obvious that these shrimp were originally one species, and may still be, but for the time being they're two.

I almost forgot to say that there is another species of shrimp that looks a lot like L. wurdemanni and L. rathbunae and that's the shrimp commonly known as the "camel shrimp." It's in a different genus altogether -- something starting with an 'R' and followed by a whole bunch of letters. It looks a lot like a peppermint shrimp except that it has a humpback. This guys eats corals!

Since all of the Lysmata shrimp are hermaphrodites (at least I think they are), I think it's better to keep them in twos. If you want both skunk cleaner shrimp and peppermint shrimp in a 4' tank, I would recommend two skunks and two peppermints. If anyone comes across any information about any shrimp in the Lysmata genus not being a hermaphrodite, please post a link in this thread. So far I have not come across anything to the contrary but this shrimp has not been studied all that much because it has no commercial interest in the human-food industry.

However, not all shrimp are hermaphrodites. In the hobby, the ones that we have to remember as not being hermaphrodites are the banded coral shrimp (Stenopus hispidus). They're definitely not! The males are considerably smaller than the females. Do not put two males together or they will literally tear each other limb from limb. These shrimp are much more aggressive than skunk cleaner shrimp or peppermint shrimp. If you put banded coral shrimp in the same tank with skunk cleaner shrimp, you always run the risk that one of the banded coral shrimp will come across a freshly-molted skunk cleaner shrimp and eat it for lunch.

Good luck!

P.S. -- Common names can be very confusing and misleading. All of the shrimp named above are cleaner shrimp, including the banded coral shrimp. Besides the two species that I named above as peppermint shrimp, there are at least another two or three species of shrimps that are called "peppermint shrimp," including a couple of species off the coast of California. The "skunk cleaner shrimp" also goes by the name "scarlet cleaner shrimp" in the hobby. Then you run into confusion with Lysmata debelius, another species that goes by the common name of "scarlet cleaner shrimp." L. debelius is also called the "fire shrimp."

And those are just some of the American common names. English is spoken in many countries around the globe, so you will run into new English common names in other English-speaking countries. In fact, for many fish species (e.g., Paracanthurus hepatus), you will run into different common names in this country depending on where you live: blue tang, regal tang, hippo tang, palette tang, etc. And, of course, more than one species goes by the name "blue tang."

My favorite common name is the "scooter blenny." There are several different species of fishes that have been sold in the hobby under that common name and none of them are blennies. Today I think we're down to only two or three species being sold as "scooter blennies" and none of those are blennies either. They're all dragonets, just as the Mandarin goby is a dragonet and not a goby. And a "yellow Coris wrasse" is not a Coris wrasse. And a "lettuce nudibranch" is not a nudibranch. And on and on.

[ToddTT]

So on day one, one of my skunk cleaner shrimp is molting. There's a partial skeleton in a corner of the tank.

Does this usually look like a near death experience?

He was laying flat on his back, not moving, near a back corner of the tank. I moved the water a bit with my hand and he sprung to life and hid for a bit. Now he's back to laying down.

Actually, just checked again, and he's nowhere to be found now.

How do these things survive in the wild??? Even I had thoughts of getting the cocktail sauce out of the fridge when I saw him laying there like that.

[Steve McKay]

Even I had thoughts of getting the cocktail sauce out of the fridge when I saw him laying there like that.

Lets eat. Just got back from the LFS, I bought three Peppermint shrimp. So we'll find out.

[ToddTT]

Lets eat. Just got back from the LFS, I bought three Peppermint shrimp. So we'll find out.

Mmmmmmmm...

[Ninong]

Does this usually look like a near death experience?

I've never actually witnessed it. My skunk cleaner shrimp always did it in private somewhere inside one of the many caves in the rock structure. The only thing I ever saw was the discarded exoskeleton.

He was laying flat on his back, not moving, near a back corner of the tank. I moved the water a bit with my hand and he sprung to life and hid for a bit. Now he's back to laying down.

Hmmm... Is that the only skunk cleaner shrimp in your tank? Maybe it was "waiting to get laid," if you know what I mean. They're hermaphrodites and they're only in the "female" state for a couple of hours following molting when their bodies are still soft. A hard-bodied shrimp (which will be carrying eggs at the time) will couple at the abdomen with a freshly-molted soft-bodied shrimp and deposit a sperm packet into the appropriate "receptacle" (or whatever it's called) on the body of the soft-bodied shrimp.

They usually do this in private for reasons that have nothing to do with puritanism. A freshly-molted shrimp is an easy target for predators, especially other not-so-friendly shrimp (e.g. an aggressive banded coral shrimp).

If you have two skunk cleaner shrimp together, then you can usually expect them to get it on about once a week, changing roles each time. In other words, the cycle from coupling to hatching of the larvae takes about two weeks. That's when they're really working at maximum speed. Sometimes they may not get it on for a few weeks. Usually they like to get it on as often as possible, which is why they will synchronize their "schedules" so that they aren't both molting at the same time.

How do these things survive in the wild???

They hide.

[ToddTT]

Dang! One day of inverts and my tank has turned into a brothel!

On a related note, when they say a fish "may eat small ornamental shrimp"... what sort of shrimp are we talking about?

And how dangerous would a Clown Goby be to cleaner shrimp?

Saltwater Aquarium Fish for Marine Aquariums: Clown Goby, Citrinis

[Ninong]

On a related note, when they say a fish "may eat small ornamental shrimp"... what sort of shrimp are we talking about?

The kind you have.

What they're saying is that a large, aggressive banded coral shrimp is safe but a smallish (say less than 2") skunk cleaner shrimp is not safe and none of the really small (say 1") ornamental shrimp are safe. This is especially true with most wrasses and fish such as hawkfish. Obviously some of the fish that we don't even keep in reef tanks will eat just about any ornamental shrimp but that's not a problem because they will already come with a warning that they're "not reef safe."

And how dangerous would a Clown Goby be to cleaner shrimp?

It should be completely safe with ornamental shrimp.

[Steve McKay]

On a related note, when they say a fish "may eat small ornamental shrimp"... what sort of shrimp are we talking about?

There talking about smaller shrimp than Peppermint,Skunk, Coral Banded or Camel Back shrimp like Anemone and Harlequin shrimp.

[Ninong]

There talking about smaller shrimp than Peppermint,Skunk, Coral Banded or Camel Back shrimp like Anemone and Harlequin shrimp.

Actually, it depends on the fish that they attached that warning to. Most wrasses will take out skunk cleaner shrimp, including fully-grown 3" adults. So will most dottybacks!

Many of those wrasses may be marked either "not reef safe" or "reef safe with caution." All of the dottybacks will be marked "reef safe" but all of the dottybacks except the orchid dottyback are a threat to eat skunk cleaner shrimp of any size.

[Steve McKay]

I've had Peppermint and Camel Back shrimp with wrasses and hawkfish without problems.

[Steve McKay]

I have a 2.5" Six Line Wrasse now with my cleaner and Peppermint shrimp.

[Ninong]

I've had Peppermint and Camel Back shrimp with wrasses and hawkfish without problems.

Everyone's experience will vary. I wouldn't try it with a dottyback.

[Steve McKay]

Everyone's experience will vary. I wouldn't try it with a dottyback.

I'm not saying your wrong by any means. It's possible that when my Wrasse gets bigger it might eat them, I have seen him eye them if you know what I mean.

[ToddTT]

I've had Peppermint and Camel Back shrimp with wrasses and hawkfish without problems.

I'm guessing it's hit or miss.

I love hawks, but hear of so many problems I won't be adding any to this tank.

What sort of hawk, btw?

[Steve McKay]

I'm guessing it's hit or miss.

I love hawks, but hear of so many problems I won't be adding any to this tank.

What sort of hawk, btw?

Longnose and I forget the other one but it was colored like a Falco but I don't think it was a Falco it might have been a spotted hawkfish.