Green star polyps not extending

[Jessie Nicoletti]

ok my green star polyp rock didnt have its polyps extend yesterday or today not sure why my blue lykenia hangs around it sometimes but i would expect them to open up afterwords. my xenia however seems to be slowly recovering (still looks shrunken but not as bad)

[reeferbill]

Hi Jessie; My star polyps do the same thing once in a while,check your salinity or maybe you added some supplements that change the concentrations and it takes awhile for them to adjust. Did you ever find your missing goby?

[Jessie Nicoletti]

im gonna call him mia also a pj cardinal went missing or was being shy today usaly all 3 chill together today only a big and small one were there , they all were eating and i see no body in any of the caves i have

my colt also shrivled up a bit( yesterday it was fine and big/fat) although i think they do that before they grow bigger if i am corect but my urchin may be prickin my corals or something cuz he hangs out there alot ( this is also pretty close to the xenia that had problems)

i just did a water change fearing there may be some unbalance or poison from the xenia or something cuz of the xenia colt and star polyps acting a bit funky

i am planing on takeing apart my sump temporerily to check the pipe that goes into the wet dry i have had firefish end up in there before ( i guess they jumped) so i kinda expect it to be there dead cuz he wasnt behind the tank and i dont think my cat took him (although the cats do seem to love watching my tank while i feed it)

im not sure if i mentioned this or not but my large urchin had some of his spines turn white now it seems that he has regained most color to them

Now that i think about it i didnt have any problems till i added that urchin ..... hmmm

[MyNameIsJoe]

Maybe it has something to do with that "kick ich" stuff you put in the tank. A lot of manufacturers claim that their product is reef safe, but most of them cannot prove it?
Something to consider.

[Jessie Nicoletti]

i did think that too although i would expect everything to show signs not just a few corals witch are supose to be hardyer then the ones that arent affected but i did a 25 gallon water change and vacumed out a cave that normaly colects debris and prob do another one next week if conditions worsen

[MyNameIsJoe]

Sounds like a plan for now. keep doing those water changes.

Also, put new carbon media in and changing it out every few day might help soak up any toxins that might be in the tank. I wouldn't reuse any carbon thereafter though.

***If I medicate my fish, I use the quarantine process. I never medicate my DT, 'cuz I wouldn't want the remote chance of harming the corals in there. I think there's a sticky on that in here somewhere. You prolly already read that tho.

Good luck. Keep us updated.

[Jessie Nicoletti]

ok went down today and my colt is "whitered" down to a toothpick with some red/brown fleshy mass near it ( it was a free frag but was doing so dam well andi got a zoa and star polyp and scoly that same day and the angel that was a big mistake ( regal died in like 3 days)

this is my normal lfs and usaly thier fish live as thier corals do great as almost all but 1 coral in my tank and about 75% of my fish came from thier

ive come to the conclusion i must have a toxin or something in the tank. Now i do have a containter of marineland activated carbon granules should i cut open the old bag fromj aquaclear spill out old carbon and put the marineland stuff in ( normaly you juswt get a new cartridge of carbon) but at this time i dont have that option as tomorow is suposed to bring a snowstorm again

ive also made a notice that each time something bad hapens its folowed by another month of bad and almost always hapens in september-feb . usaly my tank is fine in the spring till fall oddly enough... anyways this is highly fustrateing that all this hapens at once

i would be doing a large water change but i m afraid that is likely to cause more problems then it would corect

[Original Fin]

Jessie,

Although I believe the bulk of your current problems to be from treating your DT with meds, the seasonal issues you described sound like you might also be having issues with CO2. In the warmer months, open windows/doors let recirculate fresh air into your living space. In the winter, the air gets stale and is higher in CO2 concentration. This in turn, has a tendency to make PH fall.

Do you keep a log of PH tests? Can you compare what you read today with other measurements from the summer?
Some people that have this problem are able to route outside fresh air intake lines to their skimmers, and that solves the problem.

[MyNameIsJoe]

As far as the carbon goes, I guess you can put the new carbon in the old bag. It would be better if you can make a new bag out of pantyhose or something though. However, if there is no choice than go with the new carbon in the old bag. The main thing is that you get the new carbon in the system somehow to absorb what it can.

I'm not sure about water changes doing more harm than good. As long as the new water is at appropriate salinity levels and what not.... water changes should be appropriate.

I'm stumped tho. hopefully someone else with more experience will chime in.

[Jessie Nicoletti]

Original i was haveing a ph issue before but during each water change i add tech cb part b and super buffer dkh both kent products as well as a cap of magnesium and essential elements about 1 cap every 3 weeks.

i have the test kits but they are old and the testubes got shatered i plan on geting new testkits as soon as i have the 90 for them that ill need . i will be geting the reef test kit salt water test kit and magnesium test kit. about every week or two i bring my watter to get tested at my lfs ( this is only cause i dont have the test tubes atm). if something is seriosly wrong i bring it to test earlyer. i know how to test just cant curecntly atm myself.

the last few times i brought my water to get tested my conditions were nearly perfect except my calcium still a bit high and alkallinty was a bit low

i used to work in a pet store (mainly fresh water) but i was sent to other stores that had salt water , again this was about 6 years ago and i dont remeber everything that i knew back then and all my refrence books are on loan to a friend .

[Jessie Nicoletti]

Just cut open the old carbon bag removed all the carbon from it save a grain or two that were stuck. filled the bag roughly the same amount with black diamand premium activated carbon that i never used when i had a old canister filter that never seemed to work ( marineland sux as far as im concerned atleast with the magnum 350) i rinsed all the carbon in the bag with hot water to kill off any posibility of old residue /carbon dust. when i went to put it back in my filter took the time to remove my sponge part to clean it as well and there was so much shit under it. the water turned murky near instantly ( here come the nitrates i think) i tried to stop as much as i could anyway rised the sponge put it back then put the carbon then the bio max cartridges. i have a hang on the back overflow and aquaclear 110 power filter and the larger of the 2 corallife skimmer rated for 200 gal i think so i dont think it will raise alot

[gregony]

If you're doing a 25 gallon water change on a 90g, you shouldn't need to add anything for quite some time. I would stop dosing magnesium until a test kit indicates you need to do so. Unless you have a very large coral load, you won't need to add magnesium, not if you're doing regular water changes. And if you keep too many fish, more than 4 or 5, you won't be able to support a large coral load anyway. I personally think your tank's biological filtration is out of whack, you could only determine this with daily water testing of pH, nitrate, nitrite, ammonia, alkalinity, salinity, and temperature. I think if you did those tests on a daily basis (pH and temperature a few times per day) you would see that you have some strange values occuring.
I would also switch to Kalkwasser for your top off water. I used to use a 2 part calcium/buffer system and it was just too flaky. I formerly used Kent turbocalcium and superbuffer. Now I use kalkwasser and add calcium chloride (turbocalcium) when the water falls behind in calcium (a couple of days in a row-tops) or I add baking soda (arm and hammer) to make up alkalinity. But this is only a few days a month, the kalkwasser, day in and day out, is much gentler on the tank.

[Jessie Nicoletti]

temp is holding between 77.8-78.2 as far as i can tell. i have a few types of filtration as well as maybe 120 lbs of live rock and 100 lbs of live sand/crushed coral my sump is probarly around 30-40 gal ,my tank was more or less doing great till i added that angel that my lfs sugested to me ..... my dad likes the big angels i personaly love the idea of a bunch of small fish rather then a few giant ones

currently my corals are

1 hammer (4 heads)
1 torch (6 heads)
1 frogspawn
1 bubble coral ( slowly regrowing on a old skeleton maybe ontop of it i cant tell really)
1 scoly( seems better since i did the water changes)
1 blushing finger leather
1 leather that i cant identify its tan colored kinda a v shaped slightly bumpy surface its polyps seem to be white it dosent have fingers it almost reminds me of a montipora frag the way it is shaped
1 toadstool
3-5 types of zoas one zoa rock has a few types
a few diferent mushrooms 1 the size of my hand a few the size of 50 cent pieces and a bunch on a rock

Green star polyp will not extend atm
xenia seems to be slowly healing
colt lookes deterorated/deflated except for the bottom
heres what i dont get these 3 corals are supose to be easy to keep yet they are sick and my corals that are said to be harder to keep arent doing that bad at all

fish dead or missing
orange spot goby
pj cardinal

[FoMoCo Master Tech]

The easiest thing to rule out right now, would be water quality. This is just my opinion, but if it were my tank, I would do a massive water change ( at least 80%) and add fresh carbon. When done properly ( matching salinity & temperature, and allowing the fresh saltwater to mix with an airstone to stabilize Ph for at least 24 hours) there should be no ill effects. If your tank doesn't seem to ' snap out of it' , something else is wrong. You've been adding alot of stuff to your water since the angel and it may be causing some/ all of your problems. Take it slow and be careful.

[Jessie Nicoletti]

are you sure a 80% water change is a good idea even after doing about a 25% water change. if i do is it oke to let the water level pass the live rock and obviosly i should put the corals on the top down lower or is it ok to drain below some corals ( ive read some articles that say its ok and some that say never let them touch air i need to track down my air pump but i only have the capacity to make 33 gallons and that is also the container i use to remove water during a change so cant make it before hand before the light shut off i did notice that the bumps on the star polyp seemed to get bigger like they look before the polyps come out so i think the carbon is slowly helpingi am gonna put my money on the medication affecting soft corals as that is all thats affected so far leathers seem good so do zoas and mushrooms but the soft body type may be more supceptable. but this is just a guess from what ive observed i may be wrong

[MyNameIsJoe]

I would say, don't do a LARGE water change unless you have to water made up ahead of time. you don't want your water level to sit super low like that for over 24 hours.

Another large water change would be your best bet though to get any toxins out. do as large of a change that you can handle right now. Try to mix the new water and let it sit for almost a day with a powerhead in the container. Drain the old water when you are ready to put the new in.

There has to be something you can drain the old water into. Use the trash can from your kitchen. Just rinse it out when you're done.

Also, if anything(live) in your tank is exposed to the air during water change, just minimize that time as much as possible. A lot of corals are taken out of the tank for fragging and do fine, so its most likely not an issue to expose them for a short period of time.

Just have the water made up before you drain.

[FoMoCo Master Tech]

I agree with Joe on not performing a large water change without letting it mix and aerate for at least 24 hours. Freshly made synthetic saltwater is caustic and can do harm. Even saltwater for regular water changes should be pre mixed, aerated, and heated for 24 hours. 48 hours is better. If a large water change is out of the question, a series of small water changes would have to be done to eventually reduce the concentration of unwanted chemicals in the DT. Doing four 20% water changes does not equal doing one 80% water change.
Lets say you have 100ppm of a toxin in a 100g tank. Doing a 20% water change will reduce it to 80ppm. Doing another 20% WC will reduce the toxins to 64ppm. Another 20% will bring it to 51.2ppm. Another 20% and you'll be at 41ppm. So far you changed 80 gallons (80%) of your water but you've only dilluted the toxin by 59ppm (59%). You would have to do about 4 more 20% water changes to dillute the toxin below 20ppm. It would take at least 8 days and 160 gallons of saltwater ( if my math is right) to equal the same dilution as doing one 80% water change.

[Jessie Nicoletti]

so how often should i do the water change without causeing a shock to the tanks inhabitants i can cary away water in 5 gal buckets to the sink i guess easily and have the water in the trash can pre made should i leave the powerhead in the whole time and since i dont have a air pump atm should i aim it up slightly to break the water ( that should oxegenate the water rite ) and i should add the buffer at this time rite ?

[FoMoCo Master Tech]

Disturbing the surface of the water with a powerhead should be fine as long as the container does not have a lid. Saltwater already has a natural buffering ability which is why its so important to allow ample mixing time before using. You can add the buffer if the Ph doesn't match your tank water.
How big is the trash can you plan on using? Are you planning on a large water change or a series of small? When done properly, you can do water changes daily or even multiple times a day but the hey phrase is " when done properly". If you don't do it right, bad things can happen ( Ph or salinity shock, etc...). I have done 3 large water changes since starting my tank with no problems. Leebca has a sticky on performing water changes. I suggest You read it.
How to Make a Successful Water Change

[Jessie Nicoletti]

the trashcan is 33 gal but i have to lift it to a sink so i can only fill it about 8 " below the rim so that probarly is 25-28 gal that i can make at one time so you say dont keep the lid on id be a bit woried about the water spilling over a bit without it on would cuting a few holed in the top work maybe like 6 holes about the size of soda can closer to the center to reduce any spill over when doing water changes i assume that the ph of my tap water is low due to before i added buffer my tank was at 7.6-7.8 and when i started added it its at 8.1-8.3