Starting a reef for the first time. Opinions, please

[Strangelove]

Hello,

I'm a relatively experienced fresh-water aquarist with a planted 55 gal community tank and a 90 planted Cichlid tank that are both doing well. I've decided to take the plunge that I've been wanting to make and start a reef tank in my office (might as well have Uncle Sam help foot the bill).

All opinions on a few questions would be greatly appreciated.I have tried to read all recent, applicable posts.

Things that I've purchased:
90 gal. AGA, predrilled.

Used lighting from LFS- 4 110W VHO 48" with Icecap 660, 2 daylight, 2 actinic (I'm told bulbs are brand-new)

Now for the questions:
1.) LFS suggests a Top Fathom 100 Skimmer with a Mag Drive 700 pump. I can't find anything on the board about this model. Any thoughts? I'm leaning toward a Turboflotor Multi after considering all recent posts.

2.)Live rock is cheaper on many web sites (Cured Fiji at LFS $4.99/lb). I'm probably going to start with 100 lbs. Has anyone had good/bad experiences? Good sites (if any)?

3.)Ditto for livestock.

4.)LFS told me they will only do hire out their maintenance services to those who have UV sterlilizers on their setups. They say that without one an apparently healthy new fish or coral can wipe out a whole tank. Before learning of this site I purchased a new Emporer 25W on Ebay. No one here seems to like them. Dump it?


Thanks to all who help.

[snoopdog]

I would dump the UV if you are going to have corals/live rock, it goes against what we are trying to achieve. I have purchased rock from http://www.ffexpress.com and had good luck before.

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Come visit our web site, still working on it !
http://www.reefcrazed.com

[Ninong]

Hi Strangelove, welcome to Reefland! [img]/ubb/biggrin.gif[/img]

UV sterilizers are more appropriate on fish-only systems. The LFS is correct that you can never be sure about any livestock you purchase for your tank. That's why quarantine tanks are a good idea.

The problem with UV sterilizers (assuming they are properly set up with the correct flow rate) is that they kill whatever passes through them--the good, the bad, and the merely ugly. Most people who set up reef tanks nowadays, set them up with live sand beds of various depths (I recommend 4"+) that produce a lot of protein for the animals in the tank--larvae of polychaete worms, nauplii of microcrustaceans, bacterioplankton, etc. These would be harmed by a UV sterilizer. But I can certainly understand why from a maintenance point-of-view, the LFS favors UV. For the same reason, they are probably not in favor of deep sand beds--my guess is they might be recommending a very shallow substrate.

Maybe you could trade the UV for something useful.

Good luck with your new tank.

Ninong [img]/ubb/biggrin.gif[/img]



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"Neither in French nor in English nor in Mexican."—George W. Bush, Declining to answer reporters' questions at the Summit of the Americas, Quebec City, Canada, April 21, 2001

[reefland]

Hi Strangelove, Welcome to Reefland!

The VHO lighting will be fine for soft corals and LPS corals. If you are planning on some Acroporas then you will probably want to research some Metal Halides. Most eventually upgrade to them anyway for at a minimum the point distribution of the light.

The Turboflotor is a nice skimmer. There are also others including AquaC, ETSS Downdrafts and some DIY models hobbyist are making available.

You will get plenty of recommendations for liverock suppliers. www.premiumaquatics.com has some excellent fiji rock at a very reasonable price. Flying Fish Express, Gulf View and Jeff's Exotic Fish are a few more that receive great customer feedback.

Each has their own opinion on the UV Sterilizer. Mine is I have never used one and never will. [img]/ubb/biggrin.gif[/img]

Scott

[Mikeman]

ditto to all the above, I would also try to fit a refugium into your planned space at the office, especally if your going to have tangs, since they will eat all of the microalge, a refugium provides added filtration and a place to grow food for the tangs, and a great breeding spot for copepods and other good things

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Mikeman

Heros are like muffins when things get hot, they rise to the top.

[This message has been edited by Mikeman (edited 05-28-2001).]

[Rin]

Turn back now...move away from the light. This is not a hobby, it's an addiction. When you're not working, you'll be surfing the board for answers. When you're not doing any of those you'll be in your tank wondering how you can do things better.

If you're lucky, only a few fish and corals will die on you. Then you will lie awake at night wondering if you have any business getting more.

Algae blooms will send you into fits of rage. Bryopsis and hair will be words that send shivers up your spine.

Every idea will drain your wallet. You're wife and kids will only see the part of you that is exposed while you fiddle inside your tank/sump/electrical outlets. You're dogs and cats will resent you.

You will start to babble endlessly to co-workers about your new discoveries from the night before...they will nod politely, while one of them makes discrete phone call to mental health services.

If you're still not convinced--I started a 75 reef back in November--After I install my refugium this weekend I will have invested over $3000.

Still not convinced? Oh well:

1) Keep the VHOs, you've got a good combination there. Consider getting a pair of 250 Watt MH a little later. Your 90 is a little deep for VHOs.

2) I have a Urchin Pro that fits very nicely in my sump. It's quiet and works very well. It also has a nice large cup so you don't have to empty it every other day. The pump it comes with is a RIO (aka: garbage). There are other pumps that can be installed that work nicely.

2) There are many places on the web that sell live rock. They all pretty much get their Figi rock from the same place, os it's just a matter of finding out who has a special going on at the time. I got mine from Pet Warehouse, I'm very pleased with it. If I were to do it again, I would have paid the extra fee for overnight shipping.

3) Buying livestock on the web is good for those hard-to-find items and for larger orders. Unless you have some friends to go in with you, you're not going to find too many deals that will beat out the LFS--unless your LFS is total garbage.

4) UVs are good for creating a sterile environment, which is something you don't want to do on a reef tank...as others have already said. Seriously consider a deep sand bed, instead.

5) Also consider a refugium. It will help maintain a bio-diversity that is crucial to a successful reef tank.

6) Since your tank is going to be at work. You may want to learn about things like dosers and auto top-offs. This will make 'daily' maintenance a little easier.

7) An algae magnet for that 90 will be a good idea, too. It's less messy than scraping glass by hand.

[img]/ubb/biggrin.gif[/img] Welcome to Reefland [img]/ubb/biggrin.gif[/img]

-Todd
[img]/ubb/mad02.gif[/img]Abandon all hope, ye who enter here.[img]/ubb/mad02.gif[/img]

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-Todd
'There're only 3 types of people in the world: Those who can count and those who can't'

[Strangelove]

Wow, thanks for the help everybody!(gonna take more than that to disuade me, Todd. I haven't even picked up my tank yet and here I am on Memorial day :-)~ )

I guess I'm going to see if I can't trade the UV.

I keep seeing refugium (refugii?) over and over so even someone as dense as me has gotta think that maybe there's something there. I've seen a lot of homepages with pictures of people's setups and (for me)incomprehensible line-drawing schematics. Does anybody know a for-idiots site that gives a blow-by-blow description of how to plumb sump, skimmer,refugium,etc?

[reefland]

I don't know of a better place to learn how to plumb your tank than here on Reefland! [img]/ubb/biggrin.gif[/img]

Do you plan to have a refugium in the sump or in a seperate container? Optimally refugiums are placed above the display tank where it can gravity feed to the display. Unfortunately this isn't easily accomplished, still providing a finished look around your display (unless of course you are plumbing everything through a wall). Most incorporate a refugium in the sump making the plumbing task much simpler. The only thing to consider then is flowing the entire rate through the refugium or reducing the flow by splitting a single drain line or placing the second of dual drains after the refuge.

Scott

[Strangelove]

Since the tank is going in my office I'll probably be limited to keeping everything in the stand. I thought that everything could be plumbed in line:

Tank--->Sump with skimmer--->Refugium---->Pump--->Tank

Is this too simplistic?

[reefland]

Nope, that is fine. [img]/ubb/biggrin.gif[/img]

[Ninong]

I keep seeing refugium (refugii?)

Nope, it's latin, so the plural is refugia. It means a place of shelter or safety.

Ninong [img]/ubb/biggrin.gif[/img]

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"The Senate needs to leave enough money in the proposed budget to not only reduce all marginal rates, but to eliminate the death tax, so that people who build up assets are able to transfer them from one generation to the next, regardless of a person's race."—George W. Bush, Washington, D.C., April 5, 2001