Should I remove them from my sump?


Jeff

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If we as aquarists dont learn atleast one thing a day we better start our day over.

Do you have another means of biological filtration? LR? LS?

If You have enough LR (basically 1-2lbs per gallon) you can slowly remove the bioballs. Doing it all at one could cause an ammonia spike as your system will be missing some of the bacteria that it was used to having. HTH

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jImMy

"Watching fate as it flows down the path we have chose"
"...Never thought to question 'Why'?"
"A Friend in need's a Friend indeed"

pAz LeNcHaNtIn... oh how i wish...

Yes I have LR bout 1lb per gallon. I also use a magnum pro on the back to polish off the water. The removal of the balls scares me but a friend told me it was a good idea. I might do it yet just scared is all hehe

Jeff

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If we as aquarists dont learn atleast one thing a day we better start our day over.

[This message has been edited by stang69 (edited 09-09-2000).]

I had a 2 chambered wet\dry rig.
I removed 25% per chamber per week...no problem.
(prob could have done it faster)
Nitrates PLUNGED...

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-schrocat

"Whacha got in the box?"

Hi All,

The bottom line for me is that I concentrate on methods of filtration that do not emphasize the nitrogen cycle for processing of nutrients in a system. I.e my goal is to remove the precursors to nitrogenous wastes and/or remove it as ammonia as opposed to only being concerned with removing with the end product, i.e. nitrate.

Here are three approaches to doing this:

1 A powerful protein skimmer will remove “proteins” and other nutrients before they are acted upon by the nitrogen cycle.

2 Algae filtration. Cultured micro and macro algae to remove ammonia, phosphate, and sulfur directly.

3 Deep Sand Beds process detritus with a fauna community of “higher order” critters that remove energy from it and “passing on” the byproducts to bacterial and chemical processes (within the sand bed) after removing said energy.

I am well aware that nitrogen cycle bacteria act on nutrients in our systems whether we want them to or not, I just don’t work to promote these processes, except for the conversion of nitrate to nitrogen gas.

Now if you visit my WEB site, you will notice submerged bio-balls. This is a special case, as in my system, the particular combination of a deep sand bed, mud bed in the sump, has resulted in nutrient levels that are so low, that it can be difficult to keep macro algae alive. I.e. I am purposely trying to create a little nitrite/nitrate.

In a reef tank, this is IMHO, the only compelling reason to use bio-balls (and submerged at that). Even my particular use of them is on an experimental basis.

A FO tank is a different matter however and even here their use is debatable as powerful skimmers, algae filtration, deep sand bed systems etc. are shown as being capable of supporting some pretty impressive bio-loads.

So my particular objection to trickle filters is that they convert ammonia to nitrate very quickly when IMHO is better deal with ammonia and other forms of the detritus that become lodged in them via others processes.

Regards,

Scott

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The definition of an expert is a washed-up drip under pressure.
You can see my reeftank at http://www.homestead.com/spasse/

[This message has been edited by SPASSE (edited 09-09-2000).]

um..yea!
What Scott said! [img]/ubb/lol.gif[/img]

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-schrocat

"Whacha got in the box?"

stang69, do you have many fish in the tank? If you have few or no fish I would go for it, a little at a time. I have a 55 gallon with seven fish and about 60 lbs. of live rock. When I tried removing the bio balls a little at a time things were ok at first but then the water parm began to climb. I put the bio-balls back in and things went back to normal after a week or so. I do a 5 gallon water change every two weeks and my nitrates are <10. Corals, fish, and inverts are all doing fine and I can sleep at night. Why take the chance?

See profile for fish and invert info


Stang69

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If we as aquarists dont learn atleast one thing a day we better start our day over.

Cuda3,

IMHO you bailed out to quick.

In other words, without a temporary increase in ammonia/nitrite the bacteria on your live rock will not increase to meet the increased demands.

Trickle filters provide such a good environment for nitrogen cycle bacteria, that your live rock may not currently have much.

So when you conduct a trickle filter phase outs, you will see temporary ammonia/nitrate spikes.

Just a thought

Regards,

Scott

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The definition of an expert is a washed-up drip under pressure.
You can see my reeftank at http://www.homestead.com/spasse/

Scott has an excellent point here. The biological filter reaches an equilibrium state based on the amount of initial source. If we increase our biological load, we'll see an ammonia spike until sufficient bacteria reproduce to handle the increased load. The same holds true when we remove part of our biological filter -- the system has to reach equilibrium again. The bacteria count is in direct relation to the source of ammonia. Remove the source of ammonia and the bacteria dies off. Increase the source and the bacteria multiplies. But it's not an instantaneous reaction -- hence, a spike as the source load increases by either adding new organisms or removing part of the filtration that housed the bacteria. Not understanding this principle can lead to significant problems in the tank.

Agree with Scott on that. When I removed my bio-media, I had a slight increase in the ammonia and nitrites. I became a little weary and thought that I removed them to quickly (even though they were removed over a 2 month period). I performed a few water changes and the params quickly came into check and I have not seen an ill effect since. In fact, removing my bio-media enabled me to make a small modification to the filter and I added some caulerpa, to aid in the nutrient export. Nitrates have plunged dramatically since the changes I have made.

The only thing to keep in mind is that you must have something/somewhere else for the bacteria to live if you remove the bioballs. You have to have LR or some other habitat for them or you are better off leaving them in there. I just didn't want people to forget that. [img]/ubb/biggrin.gif[/img][img]/ubb/biggrin.gif[/img]

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Shelly

If the bio-ball media is removed - Do you just leave it empty? [img]/ubb/confused.gif[/img] I am thinking of doing this to relieve the high nitrate levels. If I very slowly remove the bio-balls - in the end all I will have left is filter pad and a nylon bag filled with activated carbon. Is this correct?

Aquaman, what other filtration do you have?

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Shelly

...post deleted...

[This message has been edited by ohenry (edited 09-13-2000).]