[Samper]

My Pygmy Cherub Angelfish is missing an eye much to my horror. I am curious what could have done it. I helped my lfs out today and they gave me some free stuff which I reluctantly took since I didnt do research on any of it. The gifts are as follows, A yellow watchman goby very small that my flame hawk beat the heck out of now it is either hiding or dead.......dangit, A neon goby and a Phyllidia Multifaria Nudibranch. Could any of these be the culprit? If not let me tell ya what else I have in the tank. A small arrow crab, 2 blue leg hermits, a saron shrimp .......havent seen him in days. A flame hawk, a royal gramma, 2 spotted cardinals, a frog spawn, nice xenia patch, yellow polyps, purple shrooms and a gigantia anemone........what the heck could have done this?

[Samper]

also an emerald crab

[jiggly75]

how big is your emerald crab, just asking cuz mine is about the size of a dime and just recently started attacking my tangs. we took her out and put her in the sump for now.

[Samper]

Quarter size
The only reason that I haven't removed him is because he hasnt dont anything evil.........maybe now it's time.

[Ninong]

That's a lot for a 20-gal tank.

I guess the culprit could have been either the flame hawk or the emerald crab. The crab seems a bit on the small side, so I would guess it might have been the flame hawk. The only situation similar that I recall reading about in a thread on another board was when a hobbyist posted that his six-line wrasse had eaten both of the eyes of his mandarin dragonet, thus blinding it and rendering it harmless as a competitor for microcrustaceans.

You do realize, of course, that all nudibranchs are carnivores? Most Dorids specialize in sponges of one kind or another. Why would the store stock something like that and why would anyone want one? http://www.seaslugforum.net/phylmult.htm They are specialized feeders and unless you provide them with their exact prey, they will waste away and die. Of course, it could be worse. They could be peddling a nudibranch that specializes in coral polyps. Chances are they wouldn't know the difference anyway. Just out of curiosity, does your new nudibranch look like the picture I linked for you?

[farewellnite]

id take the crab out before hes too fimilair with your tank.

[Samper]

Ninong, I've been looking around and I'm fairly certain that the nudibranch is actually Phyllidia schupporum.
Do you know someone who might be able to take care of it?
I'd be more than happy to give you the phone number to this lfs. After about two seconds of talking to them you would see that they know absolutely nothing about the hobby.....much less than I know and that's bad. The lady thought the nudibranch was a turbo snail......guess I should have just left it there cause now his demise will be my fault.

[Ninong]

Originally Posted by Samper

Ninong, I've been looking around and I'm fairly certain that the nudibranch is actually Phyllidia schupporum. The lady thought the nudibranch was a turbo snail......guess I should have just left it there cause now his demise will be my fault.

Phyllidia multifaria is the valid species name. Phyllidia schupporum is an unnecessary synonym for the same thing.

Most nudibranchs have a natural lifespan of from one to two years at most. All nudibranchs are carnivores with extremely specialized feeding habits. They are collected because people continue to buy them.

It is not surprising that the employee who sold you this creature had no idea what it was. You will come across a lot of that in this hobby. That is not nearly as distressing as coming across LFS owners who do know what they are selling and couldn't care less as long as you buy it. Wait till you witness an LFS owner pushing a pair of flame angels on a newbie whose tank is only three weeks old with the advice that "it's OK as long as it has been at least 10 days since the last damsel died." Or how about, "We carry these cleaner wrasses for customers who have problems with ich. A couple of these should take care of your ich problems. They won't live more than a few months at the most but hey, they're cheap, and if you ever have another problem with ich, just come in and pick up a couple more cleaners." Those examples were from two different LFS and both involved owners, not employees.

[Sueet]

Not to bash your (and seemingly most everyone's) opinions, but not ALL lfs' are employed by idiots.....
Two of the 5 or 6 I frequent here have given me very strong, and very correct advice for the years I have been going to them. I know this, because I don't usually take anyones word as gospel... I try to read as much as I can, and ask many questions, and then I tend to take a median stance when there are wide variances in the advice.
These two in particular have actually dissuaded me from purchases on a number of occasions, based upon factors that I had not considered. They are obviously not just "out to make money" ... I agree, many are, but ... for those who aren't, they deserve some kind of credit I think.
I know, that wasn't really the point of this thread, I just hate thinking that every newbie reading these forums will think that all lfs' are the big bad wolf

[Samper]

man, I feel so bad. Seems that no matter what I do I either get fed the wrong information of just make a bad decision on my own. I know that the reefs are in serious trouble and it's mostly cause of people like me....maybe I should start collecting baseball cards or something.

[Sueet]

Originally Posted by Samper

maybe I should start collecting baseball cards or something.

Hmm...... and then leaving the hobby only to those who may not care if they make mistakes? Caring is the beginning of learning... and nobody knows everything from the getgo..... if they tell you they do, or did.. They're LYING.

Don't be so down on yourself, just learn from your mistakes, and work on developing the patience to ask the questions BEFORE the problems arise

That's pretty much the point of forums like this one.... people who DON'T know everything, learning from other's mistakes! ... Well, and people like you and I learning from the experts like Ninong and Reefland

[Samper]

I just hate watching something suffer because of my idiocy. It's not the money or the time spent......its a life that I have taken into my own hands to care for.

[Sueet]

Well, if that is how you feel, then you need to just do your best to supply what the little creature really needs ... Whatever that may be.. you know, you could also offer the lil guy on the trade thread here..... if someone with a very large tank or something would like to have a go at keeping him...? If you're so certain he is going to die, then what could it hurt to let someone else try?

Just for the record, I personally am very happy to hear someone else feels that way about their "critters" ... as most of my family and neighbors tend to think that I am a bit off my rocker, because I feel so obligated in the care of all of my 'babies'. Maybe I am... but I like being this way, and have no intentions of changing... I hope you don't either!

[Samper]

I put the flame on the trade page....hope someone in NC wants to adopt.

[Poseidon]

I think both you guys have the right Idea, I too take my fish very seriously. The last few fish that I lost have been Suicides... the little fella leaped right out of the tank, unfortunatley not much I could have done to prevent that. Anyway keep up the learning one day it will all make sense.... I PROMISE!!!

[Sueet]

Originally Posted by Poseidon

I think both you guys have the right Idea, I too take my fish very seriously. The last few fish that I lost have been Suicides... the little fella leaped right out of the tank, unfortunatley not much I could have done to prevent that. Anyway keep up the learning one day it will all make sense.... I PROMISE!!!

Ahh... more beautiful bells chime in the song that I love Maybe that's why I like this forum so much! Sorry for your loss, but you're right, there isn't a whole lot you can do about that... *HuggzZ*

[Reefland]

The key is to research befor emaking an impulse buy that may not provide a good life for the animal you are buying.

Most reputable stores will hold a fish or coral for a week or two with a small deposit. This not only provides you the time to make sure the fish or coral is healthy but gives you some time to perform research on the animal before you bring it home and get stuck with it.

The care a dedication both of you are committed to providing to your animals is the very most important thing, now maybe you can use this tip to save yourself some heart ache.

[Samper]

Thanks for the encouragement guys. Can any of you point me to someone in NC who might wanna adopt?