75 gallon tank Capacity

[infulgeo]

Hi i'm looking to have a 75 gallon FOWLR aquarium with a high class HOB protein skimmer, power-heads that move at least fifteen times my water capacity, refugium with a DSB and Chaeto Algae, 100 lbs of dry base or live rock. I'm looking to stock my tank modestly with between 15-18 fish which are peaceful, hardy, and range between 2-3 1/2 inches. Will my filtration and setup be able to handle this and can i do monthly 25% water changes or will i need to do weekly ones with this setup?

The fish species are (the numbers will fit into the initial 15-18 but how many of each may vary)
-2-4 Ocellaris Clownfish, Tank Bred
[$11.99]
-2 Firefish
[$13.99]
-2 Firefish, Purple
[$ 29.99]
-6 Blue/Green Reef Chromis
[$ 4.99]
-4 Spotted Cardinalfish
[$ 11.99]
-2 Hector's Goby
[$ 19.99]
Pricing source LiveAquaria.com

[leebca]

Water changes come in two basic categories:
1) To remove built up wastes; or
2) To help stabilize water quality.

The large infrequent water change (25% every 3 or 4 weeks) is 1). A frequent low water change (10% weekly) is 2). With the proposed bio-load I would choose the 25% water change every 3 or 4 weeks for at least the first two years.

[Steve McKay]

Hi i'm looking to have a 75 gallon FOWLR aquarium with a high class HOB protein skimmer, power-heads that move at least fifteen times my water capacity, refugium with a DSB and Chaeto Algae, 100 lbs of dry base or live rock. I'm looking to stock my tank modestly with between 15-18 fish which are peaceful, hardy, and range between 2-3 1/2 inches. Will my filtration and setup be able to handle this and can i do monthly 25% water changes or will i need to do weekly ones with this setup?

IMO. That is too many fish for a 75g tank. You had better get the best HOB at 3 x total system water volume. A DSB in a small fuge will not be that beneficial, it should be in your display tank where there is some volume and should be at least 5". Chaeto is good. 15-18 fish is not modestly, it is too many. There will be problems with aggressiveness especially with the clowns.

[infulgeo]

yea i've done more research and have decided to keep 12 fish total, plus buying two powerheads that make 1500 gph each or 3000 gph total which is about 40x my initial water volume. also about the DSB having a rather large refugium wouldnt it be more beneficial than having it in the main display? From what i've read it doesnt do the job as well with the redundancy of live rock.
Btw the reason i said modestly is because in fresh water that size tank i have kept near 40 two inch long fish without any problems and plenty of room, i do realize however that saltwater is different and is why i cut that number in half. 12 fish however i feel isnt over doing the bio load by any means



new list:
-2 Ocellaris Clownfish, Tank Bred
[$11.99]
-2 Firefish -2 Firefish, Purple (one or the other!)
[$13.99] [$29.99]
-2 Spotted Cardinalfish
[$11.99]
-2 Hector's Goby
[$19.99]
-2 Orange Lined Cardinalfish
[$18.99]
-2 Zebra Barred Dartfish
[$18.99]

[Steve McKay]

yea i've done more research and have decided to keep 12 fish total, plus buying two powerheads that make 1500 gph each or 3000 gph total which is about 40x my initial water volume. also about the DSB having a rather large refugium wouldnt it be more beneficial than having it in the main display? From what i've read it doesnt do the job as well with the redundancy of live rock.
Btw the reason i said modestly is because in fresh water that size tank i have kept near 40 two inch long fish without any problems and plenty of room, i do realize however that saltwater is different and is why i cut that number in half. 12 fish however i feel isnt over doing the bio load by any means

I2 sounds more reasonable, not that I was saying you can't have 18. I have Koralia circulation pumps, K2=600gph in my 50g reef. I believe a 1500gph circulation pump even in a fowlr is a bit much, it is better to have smaller pumps than one or two huge pumps. I would suggest K3=850 or K4=1200 for the length of your tank and K1=400 for front to back or at an angle. I will post a link for these pumps below. There is no redundancy, LR is for nitrification and a DSB is for denitrification. Nitrification is converting ammonia to nitrite and then nitrite to nitrate. Denitrification is converting nitrate to nitrogen gas that dissipates from the system. To a certain extent there is redundancy because the top layer of a DSB will also act as a place for nitrification but you would need a very large fuge to reap the benefits of a DSB. A DSB also gives sand dwelling inverts some nice habitat. If I'm correct, there is more O2 in freshwater and (or) freshwater fish can make more use of available O2 than saltwater fish. Link. HYDOR componenti per acquari

[vio]

whoa whoa whoa. there is a lot wrong with what you just said.

first

12 fish total

might be pushing it. that is a lot of fish especially if you add a bunch at once your asking for a tank crash.

second

from what i've read it doesnt do the job as well with the redundancy of live rock.

DSB doesnt do the same function as your lr. lr uses aerobic bacteria to break down nitrite and ammonia into nitrates. DSB is created to promote anaerobic bacteria to break nitrates down in Nitrogen gas. LR and DSB, are not redundant they both serve 2 completely different functions.

finally

fresh water that size tank i have kept near 40 two inch long fish without any problems and plenty of room, i do realize however that saltwater is different and is why i cut that number in half

you recognized the difference between freshwater and salt water but not completely. freshwater fish are generally much more tolerant of nitrates and in a freshwater tank there is nowhere near as many chemical changes that could occur as in salt water. the fish you listed will not stay 2 inches. most get at LEAST 3 or 4. my small oscellaris are at 3 inches already and still growing.

now i may be wrong at saying twelve is too many and believe me someone will correct it if i am, but if it was my tank, i would drop that number. get maybe one or two beautiful display/show fish and get a working fish crew. I feel if they arent working why are they there? (except for clowns; i mean a pair of clowns is mandatory isnt it? lol it seems all they do is work on making it as difficult as possible for you to put your hands in the tank)


go SLOWWWW. Patience pays off in this hobby. the only things that happen fast are tank crashes.

[vio]

steve beat me to the response lol. he says 12 is ok. i say choose 12 wisely.

[Steve McKay]

steve beat me to the response lol. he says 12 is ok. i say choose 12 wisely.

The fish on his list are small as long as he sticks to the list he will be ok.

[infulgeo]

i def appreciate all the replies and am glad i posted on this particular site!, um for one thing i def do not plan on adding anything more than two fish at a time (to establish pairs), and while i stated the difference between freshwater as mere numbers i also was cognizant of the fact they do not tolerate many different chemical reactions even though they experience more of them. i believe the reason for this is more to do with water concentrations (i.e when a fish excretes ammonia in the ocean there is a large enough area to almost completely dilute its effects) On the topic of a DSB i hadnt really done much research on that front only the basic 4-5 articles but didn't cross reference anything. I would like to know for my size tank how much sand or how deep would be of the utmost benefit? I also am willing to knock the number down to ten, less if i must but would prefer an even ten. if the maintenance would be ridiculously high then of course the numbers would be reworked further, however another question i have which is in relation to pure aesthetics; Will having less than ten make a four foot tank look barren? Will ten be enough to maintain without weekly water changes or is this still too much??

P.s the powerhead information was great i'm thinking of going with four SEIO M820 instead of their larger more robust version
thanks again for all the replies,
-Infulgeo

P.s.s lol I looked as to the sizes of all the fish and have decided ten will be better (would still like your input tho!) and each of these fish grows to about 3" except for the zebra barred Dartfish which could also be eliminated from the mix as the organge lined cardinal fish and this species for me are interchangeable

[Steve McKay]

To have the full effect, you would need a 5" DSB. For a 75g 48" x 18" you would need 175lb.

[infulgeo]

To have the full effect, you would need a 5" DSB. For a 75g 48" x 18" you would need 175lb.

Do you have any information in regards to my other questions? any and all opinions are welcomed and appreciated
-Infulgeo

[Steve McKay]

Do you have any information in regards to my other questions? any and all opinions are welcomed and appreciated
-Infulgeo

As far as waste dissipating it doesn't matter whether it's the ocean, a pond or your tank. If the right natural resources are there it will be consumed. I have a 50g, between the 5" DSB, 100lb LR and fuge my nitrates have always been 0.0 except when the tank was first setup of course. It is not diluted, it is consumed by plant and animal. 12 x 3" fish would still be a lot, maybe not to many but if you have a very good skimmer and large enough fuge, don't overfeed and do your water changes weekly at 10% you shouldn't have a problem. However with this much of a bio-load your lighting must be minimal, any more than that and you will have algae coming out your............. You can forget having corals because your nitrates still might be high for corals, the word is might and with minimal lighting there aren't many corals for that kind of lighting. Just thought I would throw the coral part in even though you have a fowlr.

[infulgeo]

As far as waste dissipating it doesn't matter whether it's the ocean, a pond or your tank. If the right natural resources are there it will be consumed. I have a 50g, between the 5" DSB, 100lb LR and fuge my nitrates have always been 0.0 except when the tank was first setup of course. It is not diluted, it is consumed by plant and animal. 12 x 3" fish would still be a lot, maybe not to many but if you have a very good skimmer and large enough fuge, don't overfeed and do your water changes weekly at 10% you shouldn't have a problem. However with this much of a bio-load your lighting must be minimal, any more than that and you will have algae coming out your............. You can forget having corals because your nitrates still might be high for corals, the word is might and with minimal lighting there aren't many corals for that kind of lighting. Just thought I would throw the coral part in even though you have a fowlr.

Is eight fish a better number or is this still a large bio load??

[infulgeo]

Water changes come in two basic categories:
1) To remove built up wastes; or
2) To help stabilize water quality.

The large infrequent water change (25% every 3 or 4 weeks) is 1). A frequent low water change (10% weekly) is 2). With the proposed bio-load I would choose the 25% water change every 3 or 4 weeks for at least the first two years.

since you seem to be regarded as highly knowledgeable if you have any more advice or guidelines I'd greatly appreciate it!
-Infulgeo

[Steve McKay]

From reading through this forum and reading your fowlr tank guidelines allowing for five gallons per 1" inch of fish i could keep a maximum of nine 3" fish right?
since you seem to be regarded as highly knowledgeable if you have any more advice or guidelines I'd greatly appreciate it!
-Infulgeo

Well thanks, but this isn't my forum and those aren't my guidelines. I'm just a member of this very nice knowledgeable friendly forum. Your math is off. 75/5=15 =5 x 3" fish or 3 x 5" fish. 9 x 3" fish=135g

[infulgeo]

Well thanks, but this isn't my forum and those aren't my guidelines. I'm just a member of this very nice knowledgeable friendly forum. Your math is off. 75/5=15 =5 x 3" fish or 3 x 5" fish. 9 x 3" fish=135g

oh i know i had asked someone else to do the math for me ahaha but that was directed towards leebca
i'd only be able to have 5 fish in a 75 gallon

[Steve McKay]

oh i know i had asked someone else to do the math for me ahaha but that was directed towards leebca
i'd only be able to have 5 fish in a 75 gallon

That is up to you.

[vio]

Will having less than ten make a four foot tank look barren?

this is a matter of personal opinion but i would say absolutely not. i think what you are forgetting is there is soooo much more to a marine tank than fish. you have crabs, shrimp, snails, worms, starfish etc. i feel as if the fish are the most boring part of my tank. granted some of them are quirky and funny at the end of the day they are rather normal. i feel as if it is a lot of the smaller, more interesting things that really make a tank an attraction to watch. again this is all my opinion and i dont know if you plan on have any of the aforementioned creatures but you should think about it. i find the "ecosystem" in my living room the best part. not simply that i have fish swimming around. and ten fish is rather crowded imo. i have a 55 which is the same length as your 75 and i have three fish in it. granted it is a reef so i try to keep my bioload to a minimum but when i had only three fish and no corals while everything was settling in it was by no means barren.

do what feels right to you though. there are a million ways to do everything and to each his own. as i have told you a million times i think already go slow and make it your own creation.

[leebca]

infulgeo,

When I replied to your original post, it was on the topic of water changes. I had no problem with your fish list. Yes, there are many fishes there, but they are in the 'thin fish' low bio-load fish types. That is, they don't impose a large bio-load on your system. So, more inches per gallon is acceptable. I put that together with the higher than average system you described and thought the plan a good one. I am, however, assuming you plan on doing diligent and proper periodic maintenance on the system, and know how to maintain excellent water quality: What is Water Quality.

Just quarantine them properly and introduce them slowly. Follow setup guidelines found here: Setting Up a FOWLR Aquarium

Further stocking guidelines can be found here: Fish Stocking Limit - for FO and FOWLR

I would only change your decision on the Anemonefish (original list). I think you should just decide on one pair of them. The tank isn't large enough for two pairs and a small group will not get along as they try to pair off. Obtain one that is about 1" longer than the other to help the pairing.

[infulgeo]

infulgeo,

When I replied to your original post, it was on the topic of water changes. I had no problem with your fish list. Yes, there are many fishes there, but they are in the 'thin fish' low bio-load fish types. That is, they don't impose a large bio-load on your system. So, more inches per gallon is acceptable. I put that together with the higher than average system you described and thought the plan a good one. I am, however, assuming you plan on doing diligent and proper periodic maintenance on the system, and know how to maintain excellent water quality: What is Water Quality.

Just quarantine them properly and introduce them slowly. Follow setup guidelines found here: Setting Up a FOWLR Aquarium

Further stocking guidelines can be found here: Fish Stocking Limit - for FO and FOWLR

I would only change your decision on the Anemonefish (original list). I think you should just decide on one pair of them. The tank isn't large enough for two pairs and a small group will not get along as they try to pair off. Obtain one that is about 1" longer than the other to help the pairing.

Thanks for the reply, i will take ur advice and keep only to tank bred ocellaris. I was wondering if some of the smaller wrasses also fit into the thin fish low bio load category such as the blue flasher wrasse, pink streaked wrasse, or conde's fairy wrasse. If not could you tell me some of what you consider to be thin fish low bio load species, so that if i want to change my list a bit maybe even reduce the numbers to between 8-10 i can have a better idea as to what fish i can exactly keep for my setup
thanks again,
-Infulgeo