do I have enough live rock?

[craqerjaq]

I don't know the specific weight but judging by looks does my 55g tank seem to have an adequate number of live rock?

The best part is I had originally purchased most of the rock and the girl at the LFS screwed up and gave me all but 3 of the large rocks (which I just added today) for only 8 bucks! It was supposed to be 8/lb...the 3 I bought today cost me 80-90 bucks. Talk about good fortune!!

[denhay14]

You can estimate I can't really tell but you should have about 55-65lbs. of LR in there.

[craqerjaq]

I don't care about the weight so much...just wanna know if it's enough. I don't feel like buying anymore lol.

[denhay14]

It doesn't look like there is a lot of rock in there but it's your call. You should have at least 1.25Lbs. of live rock per gallon since it will help dispose of some nitrites and ammonia. It also will give off certain food for fish and other critters in your tank that you might get later. Better safe than sorry....

[Ninong]

I don't know the specific weight but judging by looks does my 55g tank seem to have an adequate number of live rock?

I think you could use a little more. Maybe a third more than what you have already.

[cdearing]

I have more than that in my 29G. I've seen some tanks that are totally covered with LR across the back side of the tank. If you have more LR, you have more filtration. Also, depending on the way you situate the rock, you have more places to put coral and more hiding areas for fish. You can always add to it as you go. No sense in overextending yourself. It's probably fine as you have it now. If you want less room for corals and more room for fish then you are probably good. You might get lucky and find someone in your area who is selling their rock at "rock" bottom prices.

[Parrothead]

If you are setting it as a reef, I would look at upgrading your lighting before worrying about having enough rock, you can always add rock, That appears to be a single tube 4' 40 watt bulb on your tank, maybe 80 watts if its a dual strip, no where near what is needed, I have a 55 as well with 70 lbs LR, and 60 lbs live gulf sand. I currently have 192 watts of Power compacts over my tank. see parrotheads 55 in the reef section.

Robert

[craqerjaq]

I'm just starting so I'm not going all crazy with a reef yet...I'll start with a fowlr and see how that goes. The light is just a standard tube that came with the aquarium...maybe I replaced it once but it's nothing more than just a light but I don't plan on having anything else besides fish so I'm good for now.

My area kinda sucks for saltwater supplies...no good stores to buy fish even...just Petco and a little shop in the mall which gets their fish from the same place as Petco just marks them up ridiculously. I don't think I would ever find anyone just getting rid of live rock in this area...would be ncie though.

I might pick up some more rock but the cheapest I can get it is 8 bucks a pound and I probably don't have the income required for a saltwater tank to begin with...but it's too late now.

[Parrothead]

check out gulf-view.com, same place I got my rock, its gulf aquacultered and is pretty dense, but his regular coraline rock that is his cheap stuff that he sells at 1.99 per lb is better than what the stores here in Jacksonville FL sell for 8 bucks a lb, don't normally promote non sponsor people here, but I found him here through another member. Frt ran me .55 per pound to have it flown from Tampa to Jax,

Robert

[Parrothead]

On other thing, one of my mentors for my reef tank here on this site, has a saying, goes like this " Rome wasn't built in a day, neither is a reef ", pay attention to that, and go slow, nothing happens fast in this hobby, and patience is not a virtue here, it is a requirement, take it easy and go slow, it'll pay off and you will learn alot and enjoy it more each and every step of the way, there are a lot of very smart people here who have been in the hobby a long time, browse around, check out the reef only forum, and the other areas of this site, tons of info, all good, and people from all over not afraid to be helpful and more important honesty, nobody trying to sell you something, just helping you.

Robert

[Ninong]

I'm just starting so I'm not going all crazy with a reef yet...I'll start with a fowlr and see how that goes.

See if you can find just one or two nice, fairly large, flat pieces of live rock. Use those to pieces to form 'bridges' between the boulder-shaped pieces that you already have. This will create more caves in your rock structure, which is important in a FOWLR aquarium. The more caves and nooks and crannies the better. It would be better to take care of that now, if at all possible, rather than later.

Another thing I would do now, rather than later, is increase the depth of your sand bed to at least 2.5", unless you are determined to go with a shallow sand bed. In my opinion, a deeper sand bed would be better and you can take care of that right now with no hassle at all. Just remove some of the water from the aquarium, pour in the sand. Spread it around a little. Let it settle down for an hour or two before bringing the water level back to normal operating level and turning on the pumps.

The light is just a standard tube that came with the aquarium...maybe I replaced it once but it's nothing more than just a light but I don't plan on having anything else besides fish so I'm good for now.

Yes, you're good for now. You can worry about upgrading your lighting when you get ready to upgrade to a reef aquarium.

My area kinda sucks for saltwater supplies...

For your size aquarium, you could have ordered a single box (45-lbs) of uncured Premium Fiji live rock for less than half what your LFS is charging you, even after adding in the shipping. You would have had to cure that yourself in your new aquarium but that's not much of a hassle, it just take three or four weeks. Or, you could have done what I did and ordered fully cured live rock that had been sitting in the vendor's tanks for at least four or five weeks and told them to pick out some really nice pieces, including some flat pieces. This is where the vendor's reputation becomes important. You don't want to chase the cheapest price because you may end up with uncured live rock that has been sitting in the box for two weeks.

Here is just one example of what you could have ordered from an online vendor with a good reputation: Premium Fiji uncured live rock, $3.99/lb or $3.49/lb for 40 lbs or more. Or Premium Fiji fully-cured live rock, $4.50/lb or $3.99/lb for 40 lbs or more. When ordering fully-cured live rock, you can tell them over the phone exactly what sort of pieces you're looking for and they will try to fulfill your request.

Obviously that is just one example from one reputable online vendor. There are others. There are also some to avoid at all costs. That's why it's a good idea to either search the bulletin boards first or simply put up a new post asking if anybody has ordered from so-and-so before. Another potential issue with chasing the cheapest online price for uncured boxes of live rock is that you might end up with 'boat rock.' That would be boxes of uncured live rock that spent a week, or more, coming over here by boat instead of by air-freight. That's why I think it's safer to buy fully-cured live rock that has been sitting in the vendor's tanks long enough so that all of the dead crap is gone. And this is where the vendor's reputation comes into play. There is one online vendor in particular who advertises the cheapest price on boxes of live rock but, according to numerous online reports, his live rock is often crap! His name ends in "con." So if you see a vendor whose name starts with an 'A' and ends in "con," you have been forewarned.

...no good stores to buy fish even...just Petco and a little shop in the mall which gets their fish from the same place as Petco...

This can be a problem. Sometimes you have to expand your potential shopping area to include LFS that are perhaps 100-150 miles away. That could be cheaper than paying shipping costs and you get to see the fish in person before making your selection. Just be sure to verify in advance that they have what you're looking for. I don't have any LFS that are truly local. The nearest ones are 50 miles away. And all three of them refuse to carry fairy or flasher wrasses. In fact, all they will carry are the typical, common aquarium fish that you see all the time. No variety whatsoever. That's why I was forced to order my fairy wrasses online from Dallas. The shipping cost a fortune!

I probably don't have the income required for a saltwater tank to begin with...but it's too late now.

You don't have to add any more live rock rignt now. You're fine right now. You can wait until you get ready to upgrade to a reef tank to order maybe 20 lbs of fully-cured live rock, especially a couple of flat pieces. You don't need to do that now.

What I think you should do right now is increase the depth of your sand bed. How much is your LFS charging for just plain, dry aragonite sand? It usually comes in 20-lb and 30-lb bags. You don't need anything with the word "live" in the title. It would be easier to increase the depth of your sand bed now rather than waiting until you have fish in the tank. Of course you can do it later, but it would be easier to do it now.

[craqerjaq]

What I think you should do right now is increase the depth of your sand bed. How much is your LFS charging for just plain, dry aragonite sand? It usually comes in 20-lb and 30-lb bags. You don't need anything with the word "live" in the title. It would be easier to increase the depth of your sand bed now rather than waiting until you have fish in the tank. Of course you can do it later, but it would be easier to do it now.

on this...I have 40 lbs of the "live" aragonite sand already...if I add regular aragonite sand do I want to be covering up the stuff that's already in there? I would think I would want the stuff currently in there to be on top...what should I do?

[Ninong]

It's perfectly okay to put new dry aratonite sand on top of what they told you was live aragonite sand. In fact, it's probably better to put the new sand on top of it.

What you have right now is NOT live aragonite sand. That's just marketing hype so that they can charge more for it. It's nothing more than moist aragonite sand. The same bacteria that they claim are in their moist so-called live aragonite sand will colonize regular dry aragonite sand once it is placed in saltwater, whether there is any of that so-called "live" aragonite sand in your tank or not. Nitrifying and denitryfying bacteria are FREE. They're everywhere! They're in the water, in the soil and even in the air we breathe. You don't have to pay extra for them. Real live sand has critters, not just bacteria.

If you purchased real live sand that was dug up from the ocean, then that's different. Or even if you purchased live sand from somebody's curing tanks or mature reef aquarium, then that's different. If you purchased so-called "live sand" in a plastic bag, then it's just wet sand with bacteria. The same bacteria that are everywhere.



P.S. -- What exactly do you mean when you say that you have 40 lbs of live aragonite sand in there already? Is it real live sand or phony live sand?

[craqerjaq]

it's from a bag...that's why I said "live" aragonite. I will check the stores in town here and see what they have for plain old aragonite.

As of this morning now I have another concern about putting more sand in on top of the existing. What I am seeing are small gel pods it looks like...something is breeding and it's so small that there's no way I could snap a pic. The bigger one which could not be bigger than 1/4"...it looks like some kind of aphid or something insect like...it's translucent and cruising over the surfaces of these tiny gel pods (mostly on the sand bed one or two spots on the LR) are tiny little ones way smaller than a pinhead but definitely alive. These critters came with my last LR purchase a few days ago...I just don't know what they are.

scratch that...they appear to be Amphipods. this is good?

[Ninong]

it's from a bag...that's why I said "live" aragonite. I will check the stores in town here and see what they have for plain old aragonite.

You can get either one. It's just that the so-called "live" sand is more expensive. If you use it to start a new tank, it speeds up the cycling process by maybe a few days but it's really unnecessary.

...they appear to be Amphipods. this is good?

Amphipods are definitely good news. So are copepods. Amphipods live mostly in the top of the sand bed. Copepods live mostly in holes in the live rock and in live rock rubble.

When adding sand to an existing sand bed, it's always best to add no more than 1/2" at a time so that you don't smother any sand bed infauna that you might already have. In other words, add 1/2" and then wait a week before adding another 1/2".

Good luck!

[craqerjaq]

ok so the slow adding of the sand will allow all those little critters to climb up and out of the sand? It seems that they were just born within the past day and there are tons of tiny little things if you sit and stare closely.

so what I'm looking for is this more or less? I hope Petco has some in stock locally. I currently have 40lbs of sand which gives me maybe an inch depth...so I'm looking to double what I have I'm guessing.

[Ninong]

ok so the slow adding of the sand will allow all those little critters to climb up and out of the sand?

They actually burrow into the top layer of the sand. Adding 1/2" at a time is no problem.

so what I'm looking for is this more or less?

Yes, that would work.

I currently have 40lbs of sand which gives me maybe an inch depth...so I'm looking to double what I have I'm guessing.

You should go for 60 lbs and add it 20 lbs at a time. Usually the regular dry aragonite comes in 30-lb bags and the so-called "live" aragonite comes in 20-lb bags. At least that's the way Carib-Sea packages it. Or maybe that's just what my LFS keeps in stock.

[craqerjaq]

do I need to wash the sand or anything first...assuming it comes dry? and are you talking about an additional 60 lbs? What is the recommended sand depth for tanks?

[Ninong]

do I need to wash the sand or anything first...

Usually I would say no but since you are adding it to an existing tank, you could rinse it first if you like. Just put some of it in a bucket and then fill the bucket with tapwater and swish it around a little and let the silt float away. That will reduce the amount of cloudiness you will get when you add it to your tank.

and are you talking about an additional 60 lbs?

Yes, that should bring you up to about 2.5" depth.

What is the recommended sand depth for tanks?

Most people who choose to go with a sand bed consider 3.5"-4" a good minimum depth. I had a 6" DSB in my 120-gal tank.

The depth of the sand bed is one of those personal decisions. In my opinion, 3" would be an acceptable minimum depth for a decent sand bed. Most people consider 4" a good minimum. I used to think that way but I now think that maybe 3" would be okay.

I didn't want to tell you to add 80-100 lbs of sand because I figured you wouldn't do it. I think an additional 60 lbs would be better than 40, but 80 would be better still.

[craqerjaq]

Do you know any places online that would sell the large bags? All I'm finding at petco for white sand is 10lb backs for 8 bucks a piece and they only had 3 on the shelf. I'm looking for an easier purchase...online is my only option other than driving an hour (not worth it for sand only).