Adding Sump to 75 Gallon Setup

[Reefer27]

Hi All,

Looking for some advice for my 75 gallon marine setup. I am relatively new to the saltwater world. Have kept freshwater and planted tanks for years and figured I was ready for a new challenge.

Long story short, I switched from freshwater to saltwater essentially on the fly and 2 years later I realize that I need a sump. There was never a good time to break my tank down and have it drilled and all I have read on overflow boxes scared me.

As it stands....in the 75 I have around 65 Lbs of live rock and an Aquamedic Turboflotor Multi SL protein skimmer hanging on now, but will end up in my sump. It is mainly fish only right now knowing that my water quality could not support many corals. I know my filtration is a nightmare and need to make a move. I am running an Eheim 2213 and an Eheim 2217. Both canister filters. After some research, it is clear why my nitrates can never get below 25 ppm. Sounds like my canister filters are nitrate farms or traps. I don't have the time to clean the 2 filters weekly. I was thinking I may be better off just replacing the media in the canisters with bio balls or something. Or perhaps taking them right out of the equation. I am using a little aquaclear hang on filter with no media to simply agitate the surface to try to avoid the protein layer.

So many questions, here are a few for now:

Am I better off without the canister filters?

What size hole is standard for drilling?

How many holes and where should I put them?

Is drilling something I should attempt myself?

Is a 29 gallon sump a good choice? I think I am looking at moving about 900 gph when the sump is functioning.


Sorry this was so long. So many questions. Looking forward to hearing some advice.

Thanks

[metalhead]

Hi All,

Looking for some advice for my 75 gallon marine setup. I am relatively new to the saltwater world. Have kept freshwater and planted tanks for years and figured I was ready for a new challenge.

Long story short, I switched from freshwater to saltwater essentially on the fly and 2 years later I realize that I need a sump. There was never a good time to break my tank down and have it drilled and all I have read on overflow boxes scared me.

I ran a overflow box with a sump on a 75 for several years and never had a problem.

As it stands....in the 75 I have around 65 Lbs of live rock and an Aquamedic Turboflotor Multi SL protein skimmer hanging on now, but will end up in my sump. It is mainly fish only right now knowing that my water quality could not support many corals. I know my filtration is a nightmare and need to make a move. I am running an Eheim 2213 and an Eheim 2217. Both canister filters. After some research, it is clear why my nitrates can never get below 25 ppm. Sounds like my canister filters are nitrate farms or traps. I don't have the time to clean the 2 filters weekly. I was thinking I may be better off just replacing the media in the canisters with bio balls or something. Or perhaps taking them right out of the equation. I am using a little aquaclear hang on filter with no media to simply agitate the surface to try to avoid the protein layer.

I agree that the canisters are probably your main problem in regard to nitrate accumulation. I don't think bio-balls will help either and in fact may make things worse. IMO you would be better off w/o the canisters altogether. I have heard of people running canisters empty with good results as filter feeders will take up residence inside... Never tried it myself, but may be worth a shot.

So many questions, here are a few for now:

Am I better off without the canister filters?

What size hole is standard for drilling?

How many holes and where should I put them?

Is drilling something I should attempt myself?

Is a 29 gallon sump a good choice? I think I am looking at moving about 900 gph when the sump is functioning.


Sorry this was so long. So many questions. Looking forward to hearing some advice.

Thanks

Definitely do not attempt to drill glass yourself unless you know what you are doing. Tempered glass cannot be drilled BTW. If I were you I would not drill the tank at all... I would either take this opportunity to upgrade to a larger pre-drilled tank or just run an overflow box with what you already have. Just make sure the box is rated for the minimum GPH you're trying to push through the tank.

[Reefer27]

I decided against drilling myself. Better safe than story. There is a place 5 minutes away from me that drills. Seems expensive but I would have to buy the bit and stuff anyway to drill. They charge $40 a hole. Seems like a to me but what do I know.

I was thinking around 400-500 gph. Not sure where I want the holes drilled. I don't like the corner overflow look because you can still usually see piping. I may go with a middle one. Although, perhaps a middle is worse for the plumbing aspect.

Any suggestions or advice?

[metalhead]

I decided against drilling myself. Better safe than story. There is a place 5 minutes away from me that drills. Seems expensive but I would have to buy the bit and stuff anyway to drill. They charge $40 a hole. Seems like a to me but what do I know.

I was thinking around 400-500 gph. Not sure where I want the holes drilled. I don't like the corner overflow look because you can still usually see piping. I may go with a middle one. Although, perhaps a middle is worse for the plumbing aspect.

Any suggestions or advice?

If you put the overflows on top you will want bigger holes/return lines (1.5'' or bigger, minumum 2), otherwise you will have flow problems. You would probably be better off with a corner overflow or standpipe plumbed through the bottom for maximum flow.

[Reefer27]

Basically the lower the holes are the better the flow. Makes sense. Does the level of the return pipe matter?

Could I go with an overflow in the middle of the tank on the back that goes all the way down to the bottom of the tank. I could have the holes drilled closer to the bottom than the top. Would the flow be ok?

Should return and drain line be the same hole size?

Thanks

[metalhead]

Basically the lower the holes are the better the flow. Makes sense. Does the level of the return pipe matter?

Exactly, the level of your return pipe will dictate the water level in the tank.

Could I go with an overflow in the middle of the tank on the back that goes all the way down to the bottom of the tank. I could have the holes drilled closer to the bottom than the top. Would the flow be ok?

Not following you

Should return and drain line be the same hole size?

Thanks

Generally speaking, your drain lines should be bigger than the return

[metalhead]

in regard to bio-balls from RC's FAQ...

"Why are bio balls bad?"
Bio balls are exceptionally good at converting ammonia to nitrite and nitrite to nitrate, but their effectiveness stops there. If they are your main source of filtration, nitrates will probably accumulate in your tank, causing algae growth and other problems, like reduced stony coral growth, and eventually (if they get high enough) stress in marine fish. If you have bio balls in your system now, your best option is to slowly remove them over a period of a few weeks in order to give the rest of your system a chance to develop natural mechanisms of nutrient export. Do NOT remove them all at once!

[metalhead]

also check out RC's flow calculator...

Reef Central Online Community

[Reefer27]

The setup I am referring to would have three holes drilled. There would be to return lines, one in each back corner. The over flow box with the drain hole would be in the middle on the back wall of the aquarium. This seems like it would be a good setup as far as flow is concerned.

[metalhead]

The setup I am referring to would have three holes drilled. There would be to return lines, one in each back corner. The over flow box with the drain hole would be in the middle on the back wall of the aquarium. This seems like it would be a good setup as far as flow is concerned.

Ok, I'm on-board now. Should work fine... You may want to consider two drain holes/lines inside the box though just to be on the safe side if your box does not run the entire height of the tank.

[Reefer27]

I am hoping to get an overflow box that will run the entire height of the tank. Would one drain line be ok for this setup. The less holes drilled the better.

Thanks again.

[metalhead]

I am hoping to get an overflow box that will run the entire height of the tank. Would one drain line be ok for this setup. The less holes drilled the better.

Thanks again.

Yes, just put the hole on the bottom, inside the box. Then you can run a standpipe up inside the box to maintain the desired water level inside the overflow box, bigger diameter the better.

[Reefer27]

Problem is that I can't drill on the bottom of the tank. I am not sure whether it is tempered or not. Not going to take the chance.

If my holes are not on the bottom can I still have a stand pipe for the return? I guess that would be a 90 degree elbow going up? Not sure if that is a secure setup. Also, If my return lines are in the corners and not within the overflow box I will have siphoning concerns when pumps are not running. Im not sure if this would mean having a big enough sump to hold the all the water down to the return line drains in the main tank???

Perhaps the corner sump is the simplest.

I thought this would be easy!!! Boy was I wrong.

Thanks again for the help.

[metalhead]

Problem is that I can't drill on the bottom of the tank. I am not sure whether it is tempered or not. Not going to take the chance.

If my holes are not on the bottom can I still have a stand pipe for the return? I guess that would be a 90 degree elbow going up? Not sure if that is a secure setup. Also, If my return lines are in the corners and not within the overflow box I will have siphoning concerns when pumps are not running. Im not sure if this would mean having a big enough sump to hold the all the water down to the return line drains in the main tank???

Perhaps the corner sump is the simplest.

I thought this would be easy!!! Boy was I wrong.

Thanks again for the help.

If it's tempered glass you will not be able to drill at all, the glass will just shatter when you try to regardless of whether it's on the bottom or sides. A good way to tell is by the thickness of the glass. Tempered glass tanks are usually made from thinner glass. There will usually be a warning sticker on the bottom of the tank too that says something like this...

WARNING! Tempered glass, DO NOT DRILL!

At any rate, the people you are getting to do the drilling will let you know real quick if it's tempered or not. Of course it would be nice if they could look at it for you before you drain it and haul it down to them. I still think you'd be better off finding a nice, used 125 thats already drilled but drilling the 75 is not impossible as long as it's not made with tempered glass.

[Reefer27]

The tank is a Marineland. I am pretty sure it is drillable. What a pain it would be if it wasn't. I should do some research through Marineland the company to confirm before I waste a weekend. Anyway, my suspicion is that the bottom is tempered. Well see. The glass does seem pretty thick. Perhaps a good sign.

Thanks

[Lucid]

My 75g bottom is tempered and has a yellow piece of paper that says the warning metalhead posted. I thought most all tanks above 40g had the tempered bottom in case of accidental breakages. Mine is a perfecto... isn't that a marineland product? Yeah check with the manufacturer website first...

Now I have seen someone drill their tank at the bottom back like you may have to do... where and who... I remember they had to custom make their standpipe. I'll get back with you when I find that thread.

[Reefer27]

Thanks a lot Lucid. Any info would be great. Seems like drilling the bottom is standard. For some reason I thought that the back wall drill holes were more common.

I am totally confused now as to what to do!

[Reefer27]

Perfecto is a Marineland product That's what mine is. We probably have the same tank. Is your not drilled?

[Lucid]

No not drilled, I really wish it was. The external overflow I use works good, just isn't that pretty.

[Reefer27]

I hear ya. I am moving soon so I figured it would be a good time to drill. I didn't realize How much would be involved in planning. Let me know if you find a cool setup where the drilling had to be done on the back wall rather than the bottom.

Thanks