is black abs plastic safe to use?

organicreefer · 08-31-2001, 07:20 PM

as the title says

icemark · 08-31-2001, 07:24 PM

As long as the mold release has been washed off. Generally ABS is the same type of plastic as the rim on glass tanks.

I remember someone using it for sumps as well (don't remember what site though off the top of my head...) because it was more durable to ship than Acrylic.

Ironreef · 08-31-2001, 10:17 PM

abs same as the pipe for drains? I would say no. Its not potable and some is made with with chemicals to reduce alga growth. i wouldn't use anything thats says its not potable

organicreefer · 08-31-2001, 11:16 PM

ironreef,
pvc is not listed as "potable" either

as far as i could ascertain,sch 40 abs is used for the exact same applications as sch 40 pvc,mainly drainage/vents.i had the same concerns about pvc when i first started, and originally used cpvc(listed as potable

).the only reason im not using cpvc is they dont have big enough pipes,at least not that i can find.id still like to find out more about this abs stuff though,it just looks to good to be true..........

MarkS · 09-01-2001, 04:25 AM

All I can say is good luck!

That stuff repels most glues. To tell the truth, I have never seen one product made out of ABS that has a single glue joint. Everything is either welded together, riveted or vacuum formed. Once this stuff breaks, it's broke. Pretty much trash at that point.

You might have some luck with epoxy, but PVC solvent wont work nor will most "plastic" glues, superglue, etc.

JMO. JME.

Again, good luck,
Mark

organicreefer · 09-01-2001, 09:28 AM

marks,
im 99.9% sure that there is a "glue"(made by weld-on) made specifically for abs.ill be going back over to osh today ,and ill find out for sure

organicreefer · 09-01-2001, 12:24 PM

yes there is abs cement.question is should i use it in my tank?it seems like someone would know the answer to this one.the abs is more compact,and is black to match my background.what more could i want?this topic has to have come up before

.im inclined to think ,if it was safe more of you guys would be using it.SOMEONE HELP!!NINONG WHERE ARE YOU???AAHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!

Ironreef · 09-01-2001, 04:53 PM

Do a search on pvc potable. You will see it/most will be. Reguardless alot of abs uses an additive to kill alga. Not all. There's glue thats all purpose so it will easily glue. But i would wonder about the affects long term? Some ppl may have luck but I wouldn't use it unless I seen the haz mat on it.

organicreefer · 09-01-2001, 05:49 PM

standard pvc,that everyone is using,ie sch 26 and sch40,is not potable.any "potable pvc" you find is something different.

**golfish** · 09-01-2001, 07:34 PM

Ironreef is not the only person that has stated this. I started to use ABS pipe in my tank and decided against it. It would be nice to use because its black but what the hec, its going to be covered with coralline in a few months anyway.

FWIW, I used sch80 in my tank......

organicreefer · 09-01-2001, 08:19 PM

golfish are you implying that sch 80 is "potable".if it is,and it comes in big sizes ,where did you get it?like i said the only plastic pipe i can find that is listed as potable is cpvc,and i can only find it up to one inch

**golfish** · 09-01-2001, 09:22 PM

lol, From what I know (very little) PVC is used to supply water to homes and seem to me would be safe to use. ABS pipe is used to drain water from homes. This is why Ironreef said ABS pipe has chemicals to reduce alga growth. Everybody I know who uses hard pipe uses sch 40 (white) or sch 80 (grey)

FWIW, I used white and grey pipe from Home Depot on my tank. Grey inside and white and grey outside.

organicreefer · 09-01-2001, 11:01 PM

golfish,did you read my post above pvc and abs are used for the same applications,mainly DRAINAGE and VENTS,at least thats what the plumbing book i looked at said

ill say it again from what ive read,sch 40 and 26 pvc are not potable,i dont know about sch 80 but someone on reef central suggested it,so i think ill check into it.

Ironreef · 09-02-2001, 01:25 AM

all the hotels,airports ect I've worked on use pvc for drinking water abs for drains. Theres a haz mat for all products. The stuff I seen is sold at Lowes,all retail store. Is potable in my area. Theres different types of pvc ...grey conduit I doubt is potable. But whatever if it is or not I know most abs isn't and contains chemicals. The stuff near you maynot. Try it an see. Nothing may happen but months/years from now maybe? This would be the best stuff and more ppl would use it if thought to be safe. = balck blends, I know a few ppl who do but time will tell. fwiw I work on large projects and see thousands of feet of pvc for drinking abs for drains never the other way. I really don't know the difference I'm not a dummer but they have always told me not to use abs for my fish tank due to the chemicals used to kil algae. = maynot be safe. But that may only apply to the stuff they used.

**golfish** · 09-02-2001, 09:38 AM

If somebody at RC suggested it then by all means

Maybe the PVC you guys get in Northen Calif is different

I think your getiing a little too concerned here. I have seen a few water setups in my time. I worked for a major Ice Cream company for 15 years and I now work for the number one soft drink company in the world. They don't use ABS pipe on the supply end.

I suggest you go to Home Depot and get your sch40 PVC pipe and fittings. I give you my 100% satisfaction guaranteed that it will be OK

organicreefer · 09-02-2001, 01:22 PM

golfish thanks for youre "help" i think ill research this one on my own .this is another one of those subjects that everyone has "heard " the answer to before and never bothered to check for themselves,obviously.

organicreefer · 09-02-2001, 02:02 PM

'abs aint safe eh?

check this out:
PIPE SYSTEMS KEEP FISH IN THE SWIM.
Marine scientists at The Centre for Environmental, Fisheries and Aquaculture Sciences (CEFAS) laboratory in Lowestoft are beating the problem of saltwater corrosion by equipping research facilities with a range of industrial pipes, fittings and valves manufactured by Glynwed Pipe Systems Ltd.

The chosen systems are Durapipe ABS, Air-Line Xtra and Vulcathene, all of which offer the advantage of rapid installation due to their lightweight handling characteristics and simple jointing methods.

organicreefer · 09-02-2001, 02:15 PM

just looked up some plumbing codes and it seems you guys are right about pvc being potable.

i had always heard differnt

pvc is ok for youre cold water supply coming from the street.cpvc is what is used IN youre house,and is ok for hot water too.i have found abs listed for use in potable water situations too so i think im gonaa use it.thanks for all the help guys

Ironreef · 09-02-2001, 02:49 PM

I've always said most abs=stuff common to get for drains sold at Lowes, home depot. MAY contain chemicals that are used to kill algae. If you don't look up the hazmat on the certain pipe sold you don't know if it has it or not. I'm not arguing if its safe or not. The post say is it okay to use abs?? Without knowing what its made of it may or maynot be. If it were my reef I would make sure. I wouldn't think algacide would be okay? Everything sold has a hazmat on what's it chemical make up. But since you found potable stuff it would be okay. Hate to see someone put alot of work and make nice pliumbing that will leech unknowns. I've seen pics of outstanding plumbing on huge systems then they wonder why they can't keep inverts? The brass ballvalves was the weak link in the system.= alot of effert wasted.

organicreefer · 09-02-2001, 02:58 PM

heres a response i got at rc

perclown: I use ABS 4" pipe for plumping of my tank, 150g, since it was built almost 3 years ago. Before I used ABS pipe for plumping, I was concerned of the saftety of using ABS, and sent an e-mail to one of the columnist at FMAM, I believe it was Bob Goemans for Sand Mail. He responded stating it is safe to use ABS. So I did, so far, no problem.

08-31-2001, 07:20 PM	#1
organicreefer Governor Join Date: May 2001 Location: Northern CA Posts: 2,171	is black abs plastic safe to use? as the title says

08-31-2001, 07:24 PM	#2
icemark Governor Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Rohnert Park, CA, USA Posts: 1,102	As long as the mold release has been washed off. Generally ABS is the same type of plastic as the rim on glass tanks. I remember someone using it for sumps as well (don't remember what site though off the top of my head...) because it was more durable to ship than Acrylic. __________________ Play well Mark www.mazdamark.com

09-02-2001, 01:25 AM	#14
Ironreef Governor Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Pacific WA Posts: 1,220	all the hotels,airports ect I've worked on use pvc for drinking water abs for drains. Theres a haz mat for all products. The stuff I seen is sold at Lowes,all retail store. Is potable in my area. Theres different types of pvc ...grey conduit I doubt is potable. But whatever if it is or not I know most abs isn't and contains chemicals. The stuff near you maynot. Try it an see. Nothing may happen but months/years from now maybe? This would be the best stuff and more ppl would use it if thought to be safe. = balck blends, I know a few ppl who do but time will tell. fwiw I work on large projects and see thousands of feet of pvc for drinking abs for drains never the other way. I really don't know the difference I'm not a dummer but they have always told me not to use abs for my fish tank due to the chemicals used to kil algae. = maynot be safe. But that may only apply to the stuff they used. Last edited by Ironreef; 09-02-2001 at 01:28 AM.

09-02-2001, 02:49 PM	#19
Ironreef Governor Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Pacific WA Posts: 1,220	I've always said most abs=stuff common to get for drains sold at Lowes, home depot. MAY contain chemicals that are used to kill algae. If you don't look up the hazmat on the certain pipe sold you don't know if it has it or not. I'm not arguing if its safe or not. The post say is it okay to use abs?? Without knowing what its made of it may or maynot be. If it were my reef I would make sure. I wouldn't think algacide would be okay? Everything sold has a hazmat on what's it chemical make up. But since you found potable stuff it would be okay. Hate to see someone put alot of work and make nice pliumbing that will leech unknowns. I've seen pics of outstanding plumbing on huge systems then they wonder why they can't keep inverts? The brass ballvalves was the weak link in the system.= alot of effert wasted. Last edited by Ironreef; 09-02-2001 at 02:52 PM.

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08-31-2001, 10:17 PM	#3
Ironreef Governor Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Pacific WA Posts: 1,220	abs same as the pipe for drains? I would say no. Its not potable and some is made with with chemicals to reduce alga growth. i wouldn't use anything thats says its not potable

08-31-2001, 11:16 PM	#4
organicreefer Governor Join Date: May 2001 Location: Northern CA Posts: 2,171	ironreef, pvc is not listed as "potable" either as far as i could ascertain,sch 40 abs is used for the exact same applications as sch 40 pvc,mainly drainage/vents.i had the same concerns about pvc when i first started, and originally used cpvc(listed as potable ).the only reason im not using cpvc is they dont have big enough pipes,at least not that i can find.id still like to find out more about this abs stuff though,it just looks to good to be true..........

09-01-2001, 04:25 AM	#5
MarkS Governor Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: San Antonio, Tx Posts: 1,799	All I can say is good luck! That stuff repels most glues. To tell the truth, I have never seen one product made out of ABS that has a single glue joint. Everything is either welded together, riveted or vacuum formed. Once this stuff breaks, it's broke. Pretty much trash at that point. You might have some luck with epoxy, but PVC solvent wont work nor will most "plastic" glues, superglue, etc. JMO. JME. Again, good luck, Mark

09-01-2001, 09:28 AM	#6
organicreefer Governor Join Date: May 2001 Location: Northern CA Posts: 2,171	marks, im 99.9% sure that there is a "glue"(made by weld-on) made specifically for abs.ill be going back over to osh today ,and ill find out for sure

09-01-2001, 12:24 PM	#7
organicreefer Governor Join Date: May 2001 Location: Northern CA Posts: 2,171	yes there is abs cement.question is should i use it in my tank?it seems like someone would know the answer to this one.the abs is more compact,and is black to match my background.what more could i want?this topic has to have come up before .im inclined to think ,if it was safe more of you guys would be using it.SOMEONE HELP!!NINONG WHERE ARE YOU???AAHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!

09-01-2001, 04:53 PM	#8
Ironreef Governor Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Pacific WA Posts: 1,220	Do a search on pvc potable. You will see it/most will be. Reguardless alot of abs uses an additive to kill alga. Not all. There's glue thats all purpose so it will easily glue. But i would wonder about the affects long term? Some ppl may have luck but I wouldn't use it unless I seen the haz mat on it.

09-01-2001, 05:49 PM	#9
organicreefer Governor Join Date: May 2001 Location: Northern CA Posts: 2,171	standard pvc,that everyone is using,ie sch 26 and sch40,is not potable.any "potable pvc" you find is something different.

09-01-2001, 07:34 PM	#10
golfish Moderator Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Alta Loma,Ca Posts: 2,925	Ironreef is not the only person that has stated this. I started to use ABS pipe in my tank and decided against it. It would be nice to use because its black but what the hec, its going to be covered with coralline in a few months anyway. FWIW, I used sch80 in my tank......

09-01-2001, 08:19 PM	#11
organicreefer Governor Join Date: May 2001 Location: Northern CA Posts: 2,171	golfish are you implying that sch 80 is "potable".if it is,and it comes in big sizes ,where did you get it?like i said the only plastic pipe i can find that is listed as potable is cpvc,and i can only find it up to one inch

09-01-2001, 09:22 PM	#12
golfish Moderator Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Alta Loma,Ca Posts: 2,925	lol, From what I know (very little) PVC is used to supply water to homes and seem to me would be safe to use. ABS pipe is used to drain water from homes. This is why Ironreef said ABS pipe has chemicals to reduce alga growth. Everybody I know who uses hard pipe uses sch 40 (white) or sch 80 (grey) FWIW, I used white and grey pipe from Home Depot on my tank. Grey inside and white and grey outside.

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09-01-2001, 11:01 PM	#13
organicreefer Governor Join Date: May 2001 Location: Northern CA Posts: 2,171	golfish,did you read my post above pvc and abs are used for the same applications,mainly DRAINAGE and VENTS,at least thats what the plumbing book i looked at said ill say it again from what ive read,sch 40 and 26 pvc are not potable,i dont know about sch 80 but someone on reef central suggested it,so i think ill check into it.

09-02-2001, 09:38 AM	#15
golfish Moderator Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Alta Loma,Ca Posts: 2,925	If somebody at RC suggested it then by all means Maybe the PVC you guys get in Northen Calif is different I think your getiing a little too concerned here. I have seen a few water setups in my time. I worked for a major Ice Cream company for 15 years and I now work for the number one soft drink company in the world. They don't use ABS pipe on the supply end. I suggest you go to Home Depot and get your sch40 PVC pipe and fittings. I give you my 100% satisfaction guaranteed that it will be OK

09-02-2001, 01:22 PM	#16
organicreefer Governor Join Date: May 2001 Location: Northern CA Posts: 2,171	golfish thanks for youre "help" i think ill research this one on my own .this is another one of those subjects that everyone has "heard " the answer to before and never bothered to check for themselves,obviously.

09-02-2001, 02:02 PM	#17
organicreefer Governor Join Date: May 2001 Location: Northern CA Posts: 2,171	'abs aint safe eh? check this out: PIPE SYSTEMS KEEP FISH IN THE SWIM. Marine scientists at The Centre for Environmental, Fisheries and Aquaculture Sciences (CEFAS) laboratory in Lowestoft are beating the problem of saltwater corrosion by equipping research facilities with a range of industrial pipes, fittings and valves manufactured by Glynwed Pipe Systems Ltd. The chosen systems are Durapipe ABS, Air-Line Xtra and Vulcathene, all of which offer the advantage of rapid installation due to their lightweight handling characteristics and simple jointing methods.

09-02-2001, 02:15 PM	#18
organicreefer Governor Join Date: May 2001 Location: Northern CA Posts: 2,171	just looked up some plumbing codes and it seems you guys are right about pvc being potable. i had always heard differnt pvc is ok for youre cold water supply coming from the street.cpvc is what is used IN youre house,and is ok for hot water too.i have found abs listed for use in potable water situations too so i think im gonaa use it.thanks for all the help guys

09-02-2001, 02:58 PM	#20
organicreefer Governor Join Date: May 2001 Location: Northern CA Posts: 2,171	heres a response i got at rc perclown: I use ABS 4" pipe for plumping of my tank, 150g, since it was built almost 3 years ago. Before I used ABS pipe for plumping, I was concerned of the saftety of using ABS, and sent an e-mail to one of the columnist at FMAM, I believe it was Bob Goemans for Sand Mail. He responded stating it is safe to use ABS. So I did, so far, no problem.