My closed loop pics Wadya Think?

**scubadude** · 10-02-2001, 06:43 PM

Here is my closed loop that is hooked up to 2 Seaswirls 1" models all plumbing is 1.5"...I have approximately 12' of head both units are driven by a Dolphin Ampmaster 3000....Help me out here guys....I thought I would get atleast 2000GPH for both of the SS's (1000 ea.) but after calculating I think im only gonna get about 1400 maybe a tad less even...all thoughts opinions, and tips appreciated....I havent glued it all together yet.

batman · 10-04-2001, 11:46 AM

That looks really good.

I see your point about the head pressure though. With all the 90s and the T it might be reducing you output too much. Here is what I did do drive two Sea Swirls off 1 AM3K as a return.
http://www.mcseguide.com/reef/images...g/Image049.jpg

I have another AM3k driving a 1" SS and 2 builtin returns for a closed cir. http://www.mcseguide.com/reef/images...g/Image041.jpg

**scubadude** · 10-04-2001, 12:12 PM

Ok I did a test run on the plumbing yesterday....and WOW first time i seen the dolphins in action! talk about some major current....it was way too much current for the seaswirls...none of the pics here have the closedloop/or seaswrirls running...I had to put a piece of plywood over the top of the tank from water spray from the SS's....anyway here is some pics of wher I was at yesterday afternoon

Notice the waterline on the tank and see how the SS's are right at the waterline....that had to be fixed!!

Heres the spraybar in action....I had to empty some water...drill sum holes..fill....and do again till i got it just the way I wanted :P

My 2 dolphins...these 2 badboys dont playaround!

My Stockman Standpipe....handles the flow rather well...and no noise!

Now...here are the modifications I made since all the above

As you can see I put Unions before the SS's as advised by SOOOO many ppl!

And if you look at the outputs of the SS's I made new ones...they extend deeper into the water.

There obviously seems to be some concern about the intake suctions being WAY to strong (fish snails etc.) Here is a pic of the intake...its fairly large and I even drilled more holes and while I did test the closed loop w/the dolphin3000 on full throttle i stuck my hand down there and its not bad at all...And I doubt i will be running at full throttle anyway!

As seen from before mods, my water line was too low I modified my Overflow box to be about an inch higher

Im fixing to do one more test run and if it all looks good then im gonna drain and put my Rock Racks and Southdown sand in....then fill w/ some SW and let the cycle begin!

thezookeeper · 10-04-2001, 01:46 PM

Rocky:

You better check general discussions, your left foot felt jilted and posted pics of your right foot in some embarassing situations. It's not for the faint of heart.

Just kidding!

Anyway, It must have been fun filling that thing up and draining it already! It's a bummer that the SS can't have that original black discharge in the tank instead of the white pvc. Do you think that will stand out once it's all done? Other than that, can you tell me what's the output of those dolphin's and what's the cost like for one? Where'd you get the best deal?

Looking good!

Joanne

**scubadude** · 10-04-2001, 03:27 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by thezookeeper
Rocky:

You better check general discussions, your left foot felt jilted and posted pics of your right foot in some embarassing situations. It's not for the faint of heart.

Joanne

LMAO!

SmartA$$.... Im trying to take pics of every little move I make while I do all this....Naturally my tank is getting more attention then the pics and the board!! Never noticed my feet until u brought it up....hehe...you would have really freaked out if I had the toenails painted!

naser · 10-04-2001, 06:27 PM

are you drilling all the glass yourself?

**scubadude** · 10-04-2001, 08:25 PM

naser I had all the holes drilled for me when I had the tank custom made....and I had to take my 55gal sump to the glass shop to get a hole drilled in it.

organicreefer · 10-04-2001, 10:37 PM

scuba,
looks good.you ran half inch all the way to the sea swirls it looks like,good move.so the ampmaster is way too much for the sea swirls eh.i havent got mine running yet.how about some more close up pics of youre sump.

naser · 10-05-2001, 01:14 AM

so basically your return is the spray bar and the ss are only a closed loop... that tank must have one helluva rip current.

FISHme · 10-06-2001, 06:42 PM

Nice set up skoo be doo be, (cough) , I mean scuba dude

Keep the photos comming of the progress.

**scubadude** · 10-06-2001, 07:38 PM

Organic:
The pump was too much for the SS's b4 i made the mod. cuz the outputs where just an inch or so under the water line...so water was splashiing all over

BUT NOW i have put different outlets on the outputs of the SS's and they are about 3"+ deep into the water and they both can handle the Ampmaster 3000 now! I would take some pics of the sump for ya but im only on day 2 into the new SB addition and you wouldnt be able to tell much until the southdown clouds settle

I will post more pics of the sump though when it settles....that is one thing I didnt take pics of b4 i put it into the stand...now its hard to take pics cuz of all the braces in the way.

naser:
yes, return is the spraybar, and the 2 SS's are on the closed loop. helluva ripcurrent you say? LMAO you have no idea bro! I wonder if a fish can actually drown

believe it or not though I got my water line around 1/2" from the top and there really isnt no overspray...The only thing that I need to work on is the overflow is loud as hell when I have the return at full throttle (I have it about 3/4 throttle right now) cuz im putting almost 2000GPH through that overflow. Im thinking of putting the closed loop on a timer...maybe only run it during the day and it shuts off same time the lights do? Right now I dont even have my closed loop turned on, cuz i want this southdown sand to settle first

Fishme:
Thanx

**golfish** · 10-06-2001, 09:38 PM

Rocky,
Are you using a AM3000 for sump retun also? One thing I did was have my spray bar (sump return also) blow across the back of the tank. That's the one place my 1" SS's cant get too. I may be wrong but it looks like your spary bar just shoots water towards the front. You may want to point it down so it moves water at the back of the tank also......Just a thought.

Everything looks really good. A canister filter works real good clearing up the tank. I know all about that Southdown cream coffee look

I used one of those Magnum HOT canister filters, its real easy to clean and you don't have all those hoses like on the Magnum 300. You'll see that after you get the sand in and the tank clears up adding just one piece of LR will stir it up again and you wont be able to see what your doing (stacking LR)

Mark

Ltspd · 10-07-2001, 08:24 AM

Ok Rocky how about a suggestion. Strickly a opinion on my part.

I cant tell but it looks as if you have the vibration pad under the AM, which is good.

You may or may not have a problem with vibration transmition but here is my suggestion. It looks as if you hard piped the system. I would break a straight section and couple in a pc of flex pvc. This will allow some "flex" and keep any noise/vibration from coming from the pumps back up to the tank.

You know I am jealous

**golfish** · 10-07-2001, 09:23 AM

Good catch Paul, I didn't even think of that.....I use a small section of flex line on all my hard pipe except for the overflows....

naser · 10-08-2001, 01:23 AM

on the stockman mod on your overflow... the air tube is the solution. ive got the same but mine on the cap has about 7 or 8 little holes with air lines stuck in them. try that it stops the slurping and the air noise.@@@

BigLar · 10-09-2001, 11:26 AM

Scubadude,

Very nice setup! A few questions though.

How loud are your 1" Seaswirls?

What kind of water flow do you get with the modifications you made to the Seaswirls? Is it still strong? With the modifications, do you think your achieving 2000gph?

I really like your plumbing job. With all the elbows, do you think it hinders your flow?

**scubadude** · 10-09-2001, 02:18 PM

golfish:

Yes i have some holes pointing down and all over actually on the spraybar....you can only see the holes pointing toward the front of the tank cuz they are the biggest holes. I think the water is starting to clear up (after 4-5days) but its still cloudy. I put some of those cheap filter floss pads in my overflow and they have caught alot of crap....just have to clean them out periodically. I would buy a HOT mag filter like you suggest but thats more $$ and like i said i do think its starting to clear sum now. also with euro bracing its kinda hard to just hang somehting on the side of the tank :P

Paul:

Once again you are correct bro! I thought i could do all of it w/out flex tubing but your suggestion makes very good sense and I think I will do that!

Naser:

The stockman i have finally gotten fairly quiet....THANK GOD! however the water falling in the overflow makes a bit of noise, but its not too terribly bad....im sure I will figure something out to quiet that too eventually.

BigLar:

I havent had the closed loop on that much....cuz i want my southodown sand to settle b4 turning it back on, however the SS's I am very happy with so far....they are not noisy at all. and as far as me getting 2000gph through the both of em....Im sure im getting atleast 2000gph through them!! if not more! If you look at the system and really study flow rates and actual head, its not like everyone thinks it is....for example a longsweep elbow will not reduce flow near as much as a regular elbow, and horizontal head is not near as restricting as vertical head, also you do not count head that is below the intake. With all that into consideration, what i orginally thought was around 11' feet of head ended up actually being around 6' of head and with the AM3000 at full throttle I have awesome flow!

BigLar · 10-09-2001, 04:05 PM

I just read that Seaswirl will not warranty them if more than the max flow is ran through them. I guess they can tell when this is done. Are you concerned about this? Although, the way you have it setup may fix the limitation.

**scubadude** · 10-09-2001, 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BigLar
I just read that Seaswirl will not warranty them if more than the max flow is ran through them. I guess they can tell when this is done. Are you concerned about this? Although, the way you have it setup may fix the limitation.

There is a simple fix to this....ball valves before and after the pump. Never turn the ball valve before the pump (intake side) during operation of the pump though.....the output ball valve can be throttled down to prevent too much flow.....you can browse up the pictures and see the ball valves on my system

this will also allow for you to totally close both valves (when pump is powered off) and switch out the pumps if there is ever a problem.

omegatron · 10-12-2001, 08:55 PM

ScubaDude,

Looks like a nice setup. Can't wait to see pictures of it setup completely with rock and all. I bet though the water flow might be a bit rough in spots.

10-02-2001, 06:43 PM	#1
scubadude Moderator Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Wichita, Kansas Posts: 5,241	My closed loop pics Wadya Think? Here is my closed loop that is hooked up to 2 Seaswirls 1" models all plumbing is 1.5"...I have approximately 12' of head both units are driven by a Dolphin Ampmaster 3000....Help me out here guys....I thought I would get atleast 2000GPH for both of the SS's (1000 ea.) but after calculating I think im only gonna get about 1400 maybe a tad less even...all thoughts opinions, and tips appreciated....I havent glued it all together yet. __________________ Rocky

10-04-2001, 12:12 PM	#3
scubadude Moderator Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Wichita, Kansas Posts: 5,241	Ok I did a test run on the plumbing yesterday....and WOW first time i seen the dolphins in action! talk about some major current....it was way too much current for the seaswirls...none of the pics here have the closedloop/or seaswrirls running...I had to put a piece of plywood over the top of the tank from water spray from the SS's....anyway here is some pics of wher I was at yesterday afternoon Notice the waterline on the tank and see how the SS's are right at the waterline....that had to be fixed!! Heres the spraybar in action....I had to empty some water...drill sum holes..fill....and do again till i got it just the way I wanted :P My 2 dolphins...these 2 badboys dont playaround! My Stockman Standpipe....handles the flow rather well...and no noise! Now...here are the modifications I made since all the above As you can see I put Unions before the SS's as advised by SOOOO many ppl! And if you look at the outputs of the SS's I made new ones...they extend deeper into the water. There obviously seems to be some concern about the intake suctions being WAY to strong (fish snails etc.) Here is a pic of the intake...its fairly large and I even drilled more holes and while I did test the closed loop w/the dolphin3000 on full throttle i stuck my hand down there and its not bad at all...And I doubt i will be running at full throttle anyway! As seen from before mods, my water line was too low I modified my Overflow box to be about an inch higher Im fixing to do one more test run and if it all looks good then im gonna drain and put my Rock Racks and Southdown sand in....then fill w/ some SW and let the cycle begin! __________________ Rocky

10-04-2001, 01:46 PM	#4
thezookeeper Mayor Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Pittsburgh,PA, USA Posts: 992	Rocky: You better check general discussions, your left foot felt jilted and posted pics of your right foot in some embarassing situations. It's not for the faint of heart. Just kidding! Anyway, It must have been fun filling that thing up and draining it already! It's a bummer that the SS can't have that original black discharge in the tank instead of the white pvc. Do you think that will stand out once it's all done? Other than that, can you tell me what's the output of those dolphin's and what's the cost like for one? Where'd you get the best deal? Looking good! Joanne __________________ "Life savings? Sure, it's that brightly lit object sitting in the livingroom."

10-04-2001, 08:25 PM	#7
scubadude Moderator Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Wichita, Kansas Posts: 5,241	naser I had all the holes drilled for me when I had the tank custom made....and I had to take my 55gal sump to the glass shop to get a hole drilled in it. __________________ Rocky

10-06-2001, 06:42 PM	#10
FISHme Council Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: Pompano Beach, Florida Posts: 495	Nice set up skoo be doo be, (cough) , I mean scuba dude Keep the photos comming of the progress. __________________ FISH, FISHme or [\[\ark

10-04-2001, 11:46 AM	#2
batman Just Moved In Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Burlington, MA, USA Posts: 40	That looks really good. I see your point about the head pressure though. With all the 90s and the T it might be reducing you output too much. Here is what I did do drive two Sea Swirls off 1 AM3K as a return. http://www.mcseguide.com/reef/images...g/Image049.jpg I have another AM3k driving a 1" SS and 2 builtin returns for a closed cir. http://www.mcseguide.com/reef/images...g/Image041.jpg

10-04-2001, 06:27 PM	#6
naser super-reefer Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: SAN DIEGO, CA Posts: 1,908	are you drilling all the glass yourself?

10-04-2001, 10:37 PM	#8
organicreefer Governor Join Date: May 2001 Location: Northern CA Posts: 2,171	scuba, looks good.you ran half inch all the way to the sea swirls it looks like,good move.so the ampmaster is way too much for the sea swirls eh.i havent got mine running yet.how about some more close up pics of youre sump.

10-05-2001, 01:14 AM	#9
naser super-reefer Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: SAN DIEGO, CA Posts: 1,908	so basically your return is the spray bar and the ss are only a closed loop... that tank must have one helluva rip current.

10-06-2001, 07:38 PM	#11
scubadude Moderator Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Wichita, Kansas Posts: 5,241	Organic: The pump was too much for the SS's b4 i made the mod. cuz the outputs where just an inch or so under the water line...so water was splashiing all over BUT NOW i have put different outlets on the outputs of the SS's and they are about 3"+ deep into the water and they both can handle the Ampmaster 3000 now! I would take some pics of the sump for ya but im only on day 2 into the new SB addition and you wouldnt be able to tell much until the southdown clouds settle I will post more pics of the sump though when it settles....that is one thing I didnt take pics of b4 i put it into the stand...now its hard to take pics cuz of all the braces in the way. naser: yes, return is the spraybar, and the 2 SS's are on the closed loop. helluva ripcurrent you say? LMAO you have no idea bro! I wonder if a fish can actually drown believe it or not though I got my water line around 1/2" from the top and there really isnt no overspray...The only thing that I need to work on is the overflow is loud as hell when I have the return at full throttle (I have it about 3/4 throttle right now) cuz im putting almost 2000GPH through that overflow. Im thinking of putting the closed loop on a timer...maybe only run it during the day and it shuts off same time the lights do? Right now I dont even have my closed loop turned on, cuz i want this southdown sand to settle first Fishme: Thanx __________________ Rocky

10-06-2001, 09:38 PM	#12
golfish Moderator Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Alta Loma,Ca Posts: 2,925	Rocky, Are you using a AM3000 for sump retun also? One thing I did was have my spray bar (sump return also) blow across the back of the tank. That's the one place my 1" SS's cant get too. I may be wrong but it looks like your spary bar just shoots water towards the front. You may want to point it down so it moves water at the back of the tank also......Just a thought. Everything looks really good. A canister filter works real good clearing up the tank. I know all about that Southdown cream coffee look I used one of those Magnum HOT canister filters, its real easy to clean and you don't have all those hoses like on the Magnum 300. You'll see that after you get the sand in and the tank clears up adding just one piece of LR will stir it up again and you wont be able to see what your doing (stacking LR) Mark

10-07-2001, 08:24 AM	#13
Ltspd Governor Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Arden, NC USA Posts: 2,767	Ok Rocky how about a suggestion. Strickly a opinion on my part. I cant tell but it looks as if you have the vibration pad under the AM, which is good. You may or may not have a problem with vibration transmition but here is my suggestion. It looks as if you hard piped the system. I would break a straight section and couple in a pc of flex pvc. This will allow some "flex" and keep any noise/vibration from coming from the pumps back up to the tank. You know I am jealous __________________ Paul C Timing has an awful lot to do with the outcome of a rain dance.

10-07-2001, 09:23 AM	#14
golfish Moderator Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Alta Loma,Ca Posts: 2,925	Good catch Paul, I didn't even think of that.....I use a small section of flex line on all my hard pipe except for the overflows....

10-08-2001, 01:23 AM	#15
naser super-reefer Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: SAN DIEGO, CA Posts: 1,908	on the stockman mod on your overflow... the air tube is the solution. ive got the same but mine on the cap has about 7 or 8 little holes with air lines stuck in them. try that it stops the slurping and the air noise.@@@

10-09-2001, 11:26 AM	#16
BigLar Council Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: US, MI Posts: 289	Scubadude, Very nice setup! A few questions though. How loud are your 1" Seaswirls? What kind of water flow do you get with the modifications you made to the Seaswirls? Is it still strong? With the modifications, do you think your achieving 2000gph? I really like your plumbing job. With all the elbows, do you think it hinders your flow? __________________ -BigLar

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10-09-2001, 02:18 PM	#17
scubadude Moderator Join Date: Nov 2000 Location: Wichita, Kansas Posts: 5,241	golfish: Yes i have some holes pointing down and all over actually on the spraybar....you can only see the holes pointing toward the front of the tank cuz they are the biggest holes. I think the water is starting to clear up (after 4-5days) but its still cloudy. I put some of those cheap filter floss pads in my overflow and they have caught alot of crap....just have to clean them out periodically. I would buy a HOT mag filter like you suggest but thats more $$ and like i said i do think its starting to clear sum now. also with euro bracing its kinda hard to just hang somehting on the side of the tank :P Paul: Once again you are correct bro! I thought i could do all of it w/out flex tubing but your suggestion makes very good sense and I think I will do that! Naser: The stockman i have finally gotten fairly quiet....THANK GOD! however the water falling in the overflow makes a bit of noise, but its not too terribly bad....im sure I will figure something out to quiet that too eventually. BigLar: I havent had the closed loop on that much....cuz i want my southodown sand to settle b4 turning it back on, however the SS's I am very happy with so far....they are not noisy at all. and as far as me getting 2000gph through the both of em....Im sure im getting atleast 2000gph through them!! if not more! If you look at the system and really study flow rates and actual head, its not like everyone thinks it is....for example a longsweep elbow will not reduce flow near as much as a regular elbow, and horizontal head is not near as restricting as vertical head, also you do not count head that is below the intake. With all that into consideration, what i orginally thought was around 11' feet of head ended up actually being around 6' of head and with the AM3000 at full throttle I have awesome flow! __________________ Rocky

10-09-2001, 04:05 PM	#18
BigLar Council Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: US, MI Posts: 289	I just read that Seaswirl will not warranty them if more than the max flow is ran through them. I guess they can tell when this is done. Are you concerned about this? Although, the way you have it setup may fix the limitation. __________________ -BigLar

10-12-2001, 08:55 PM	#20
omegatron Governor Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Abingdon, Maryland Posts: 1,453	looking good! ScubaDude, Looks like a nice setup. Can't wait to see pictures of it setup completely with rock and all. I bet though the water flow might be a bit rough in spots. __________________ Chuck DIVE IN AND VISIT ME: Omegatron's Reefs Administrator at Reeftalk

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